Ved: 4 Atharv Ved: Kānd 14| Vivāh Kānd: Sookt 1| Mantr 2

Ved: Ved Bhāshý

4 Atharv Ved

 Kānd 14 Vivāh Kānd:

 Sūkt 1| Mantr 2

DSM Satyarthi

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1By Som  Ādityās strong2 by Som Earth great3

No doubt4, in the genital organ of these constellations5, Som is established optimum6.

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1.R’shikā: Sūryā Sāvitrī

Dévtā/ Divine Subject: Som

Chhand/Meter: Anushŧup

2. Ved is revealed in a telegraphic language, not in any ordinary language.

This basic fact, about Ved, always must be remembered while studying Ved gravely.

I’m sorry to say that the Westerners never studied Ved gravely.

I’m sorrier to say that the Westerners were never serious not only about Ved.

They were never equally serious about Bible and Qur’an too, as well.

These scriptures were never seriously studied by the Westerners.

If they were ever studied seriously, by the Westerners; the Western Culture, now on the path of its certain suicide, would never were on its suicidal path.

It was an unfortunate tragedy that when Ved, Bible and Qur’an were being studied by the Westerners, the Communism was fighting its own war of survival with religion.

It made the Communist thinkers more biased those days than they are not biased even today.

No biased studies should be taken seriously ever.

Yet, isn’t it a tragedy that, the entirely biased studies of those days, by the Communist thinkers are still being taken seriously?

Isn’t it a time to re-study Ved, Bible, Qur’an and the related literature more seriously, scientifically and absolutely unbiased, for a change?

We have one more benefit the Communist thinkers of those days didn’t have.

The Communism in those days was utopian somewhat, even after the great scientific studies Karl Marx and Frederick Engels did then.

It was not a scientific fact, known those days that, the Multiverse is made of vibrations of energy basically.

This fact, revealed and accepted scientifically afterwards, has changed the entire scenario of scientific studies about the matters the Communist thinkers had done their studies.

Marriage institution is also one of them.

The persons who have studied Western Culture seriously know very well that the Western Culture does not stand on scientific grounds only.

In fact, no culture can ever stand on scientific grounds only howsoever it insists to stand.

Any theory, any fact, when it is brought into practice always succumbs to human emotions prevailing those days.

It has to.

It hasn’t another option if it has to come into practice.

Humans never react scientifically only.

Neither can they ever do it.

Scientific facts are never emotional until they are facts only.

As soon as they are brought into practice they have to deal with the humans.

Humans include both males and females.

Not only females are emotional ones, the males are also not very different in the matter.

No doubt, the females are more emotionals than the males.

Nevertheless, even the males are not devoid of emotions absolutely.

Hence, any scientific fact, however factually it is known to us, when brought into practice, is bound to succumb to the emotional needs of the humans those are bringing it into practice.

That’s why the theory and practice always differ howsoever honest its implementers are.

That’s why even Eīshān Param Brahm Paramātmā has instructed us not to confine ourselves to the principles only i.e. Ved, but  to the very Mission of Life/ExistenceKr’ñvanto VishvamāryamDharm Santānam, Dharm Sansthāpan, as well; to bring the principles into practice and study Divý Itihās, the Divine History for it:

  1. Dhiyo yo nah prachodayāt
  2. Yāthātathyatah

This fact, once realized in its full form, can immensely help us to re-study about marriage institution once opposed by the Communist thinkers so insistently, so persistently.

The Communist thinkers of those days found marriage institution an immensely avoidable obstacle in their pathway to Communism.

They thought marriage institutions give birth to Private Property.

The Communist thinkers were right.

But they were not right in thinking that the family was the only institution that caused the accumulation of Private Property.

Moreover, owing to immense drastic failure of communist economic, social and political system around the entire globe, we have to think more gravely now do we really need to oppose private property anymore.

Aren’t the financial scams, not done by the advocates of Private Property, more serious, more dangerous and more destructive to the humanity and Democracy than the Private Property itself is?

We should never forget that the destruction of Private Property absolutely, leads to destroy the family itself.

Frederick Engels has already written in the subject as much as we don’t need any analysis more to understand the subject comprehensively.

We need Private Property to protect and safeguard a family.

We have no other option to it.

Consequently, why not support Welfare Capitalism and State Capitalism instead of opposing Private Property?

We have experienced bitterly that our industries can’t survive in so-called Communism.

Moreover, we have experienced bitterly too that Communism has led to a totalitarianism called Stalinism now.

We need industries to go ahead.

In fact, we need industries to march ahead.

The Welfare Capitalism and State Capitalism are more suitable for it then the so-called Communism or the ‘Socialism’ prone to nonstop Scams.

Shouldn’t we think over it more gravely now?

Today, we can easily observe around us that even the singles have Private Property.

Moreover, to be more exactly honest and sincere, the entire history of humankind has proven now that the singles crave for Private Property even more than the married persons do.

Why is it so?

Because the married persons have their family to take care of them in their old age, while the singles don’t.

They have only their money to take care of them in their old age.

It is the reason why the singles are found more corrupt than the married persons in accumulating Private Property and wealth.

That’s why Hinduism does not support single life, except only when a single can’t afford even a single wife.

It specifically orders:

S’ nah pitév sūnavé’gné sūpāyano bhav,

Sachasvā nah svastayé.’

‘He, be unto us, as a father to son, Agni, easy to access.

Be together optimum, properly, for our welfare.’

—      Ved: R’gved: 1| 1| 9

Ihaiv stam mā vi yaushŧam vishvamāyurvyashnutam,

Krīdantau putrairnaptr’bhirmodmānau své gr’hé.’

‘Abide ye both only here. Don’t be separated. Enjoy whole life sporting with sons grandsons, rejoicing in own home.’

—      Ved: R’gved: 10| 85| 42

Ihaiv stam mā vi yaushŧam vishvamāyurvyashnutam,

Krīdantau putrairnaptr’bhirmodmānau svastakau.’

‘Abide ye both only here. Don’t be separated. Enjoy whole life sporting with sons grandsons4, rejoicing in the lovely home.’

—      Ved: Atharv Ved: 14|1|22

The Communist thinkers never thought, neither they could, in those days of too limited resources to research anything that, marriage institution was not the only vice in their pathway to Communism.

In fact, the singles are more severe problems in their way.

The Communist thinkers wildly opposed marriage institution and family.

In fact they are still opposing it blindly, not even realizing the fact that the entire history of humankind has already proven them wrong now.

The Communism as a movement has lost its original momentum now.

It is not because it’s nonsense, as it’s claimed by its blind communal opponents.

The Communism as a movement is not nonsense.

It is necessary for the uplifting of the downtroddens.

Even Hinduism has the same goal as The Communism as a movement has.

The point where Hinduism differs with the Communism as a movement is not its goal, its means of implementation instead.

So, the Communism as a movement doesn’t need to oppose either marriage institution or family ever to achieve its mission.

Hinduism, Islam, Judaism, Christianity, in fact no religion, basically, is in opposition to the Communism as a movement, at all.

The Communism as a movement believed that the mission could be achieved through the dictatorship of the laborers.

The subsequent history of humankind has now expressly proven that such a belief of the then Communists was wrong.

Why?

Because, as already said, the Communism was then only a theory.

It was never practiced by its propellers.

Every theory when it is brought into practice, always refines itself.

No theorist can ever anticipate, absolutely and flawlessly, what lies in its pathway in future.

After all, every theorist, whatsoever theory he/she propels, is a human being, and bound to remain a human being.

A human being is not an omniscient, neither he/she ever can be.

So, howsoever the theory he/she proposes is flawless when propelled, it’s bound to prove in future that it wasn’t so.

The laborers never knew how the enterprises are built up and run.

If they had known how to build up enterprises and how to run them, they would have already done it without any help of the Communist thinkers.

Why have they waited for the moment the Communist thinkers declare them the dictators of a country?

To build up any enterprise first of all an enterpriser has to dream of it to the extent that it becomes an obsession to him/her.

Until and unless it isn’t an obsession to him even an enterpriser can’t build up any enterprise let alone any laborer or a group of laborers.

An enterpriser builds up his/her enterprise first in his/her own mind with its each and every minutest details.

He is so obsessed with these minutest details that, he sees it in his mind.

This imaginary vision in his/her mind always exists in his/her mind while he/she attempts to bring it into fact.

Until and unless this obsession does not become his/her madness, he/she can’t bring into existence.

It’s also a labor, the original Communist thinkers never realized.

That’s why when they took hold of the excellently running enterprises and put them under the dictatorship of the laborers, even the excellently running enterprises failed to continue.

The dictators lacked this vision, this obsession, and this madness.

It was the oxygen an enterpriser supplies to the enterprises.

Unfortunately only he/she can do it, none else.

The Communist thinkers never realized it.

The Communist thinkers made the laborers dictators on the shrewd persons who knew very well how to win the obstacles in their pathways.

They bribed the laborers in administration heavily.

The laborers in administration had never seen money.

They surrendered to the bribery of shrewdest businesspersons.

The movement started suffering heavily.

And ultimately it flopped.

It had to.

The laborers in administration were most of the persons who were everlosers.*

Watch your present day politicians.

Who are they?

Isn’t it a fact that most of them are the persons who are highly Uneducated/Under educated?

Isn’t it a fact that so many of them are criminal/criminal minded?

Why is it so?

Because most of the laborers in administration were dictators, but the persons they dictated were shrewder and more efficient.

The businesspersons became kingmakers instead of kings.

Apparently the businesspersons were not administrators, the chosen representatives of the people were.

But the businesspersons were kingmakers and shrewder.

The dictatorship of the Uneducated/Under educated ones, on shrewder persons, made itself ineffective.

Administration requires prudence.

The laborers in administration hadn’t developed it.

The system, consequently, failed.

It had to.*

Ved: 4 Atharv Ved: Kānd 14| Vivāh Kānd: Sookt 1| Mantr 3

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More Commentary on Ved from DSM Satyarthi:

1. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 1| Mantr 1

2. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 1| Mantr 2

3. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 1| Mantr 3

4. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 5| Mantr 3

5. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 7| Mantr 5

6. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 7| Mantr 8

4. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 19| Mantr 1

5. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 19| Mantr 2

6. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 19| Mantr 3

7. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 19| Mantr 4

8. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 19| Mantr 5

9. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 19| Mantr 6

10. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 19| Mantr 7

11. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 19| Mantr 8

12.R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 19| Mantr 9

13. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 33| Mantr 1

14. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 33| Mantr 2

14. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 58| Mantr 6

15. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 164| Mantr 20

16. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 164| Mantr 46

17. R’gved: Mandal 2| Sookt 1| Mantr 1

18 R’gved: Mandal 3| Sookt 1| Mantr 1

19. R’gved: Mandal 3| Sookt 6| Mantr 2

20. R’gved: Mandal 4| Sookt 1| Mantr 1

21. R’gved: Mandal 4| Sookt 26| Mantr 2

22. R’gved: Mandal 5| Sookt 1| Mantr 1

23. R’gved: Mandal 6| Sookt 1| Mantr 1

24. R’gved: Mandal 7| Sookt 1| Mantr 1

25. R’gved: Mandal 8| Sookt 1| Mantr 1

26. R’gved: Mandal 9| Sookt 1| Mantr 1

27. R’gved: Mandal 9| Sookt 63| Mantr 4-5

28. R’gved: Mandal 10| Sookt 1| Mantr 1

29. R’gved: Mandal 10| Sookt 85| Mantr 42

30. Yajurved: Adhyaay’ 1| Mantr 1

31. Yajurved: Adhyaay’ 1| Mantr 2

32. Yajurved: Adhyaay’ 1| Mantr 3

33. Yajurved: Adhyaay’ 1| Mantr 4

34. Yajurved: Adhyaay’ 11| Mantr 1

35. Yajurved: Adhyaay’ 13| Mantr 4

36. Yajurved: Adhyaay’ 23| Mantr 3

37. Yajurved: Adhyaay’ 31| Mantr 18

38. Yajurved: Adhyaay’ 40| Mantr2

39. Yajurved: Adhyaay’ 40| Mantr8

40. Saamved: Mantr 1

41. Sāmved: Mantr 115

42. Sāmved: Mantr 641: Mahānāmnyārchik| 1

43. Sāmved: Mantr 650: Mahānāmnyārchik| 10

44. Sāmved: Mantr 651: Uttarārchik

45. Atharv Ved: Kaand 1| Sookt 1| Mantr 1

46.  Atharv Ved: Kānd 3| Sookt 30| Mantr 3

47. Atharv Ved: Kānd 3| Sookt 30| Mantr 4

48. Atharv Ved: Kānd 3| Sookt 30| Mantr 6

49. Atharv Ved: Kānd 4| Sookt 4| Mantr 6

50. Atharv Ved: Kānd 4| Sookt 4| Mantr 7

51. Atharv Ved: Kānd 4| Sookt 4| Mantr 8

52. Atharv Ved: Kaand 4| Sookt 13| Mantr 1

53. Atharv Ved: Kaand 8| Sookt 1| Mantr 6

54. Atharv Ved: Kaand 8| Sookt 4| Mantr 22

55. Atharv Ved: Kaand 14| Sookt 1| Mantr 1

56. Atharv Ved: Kaand 14| Sookt 1| Mantr 2

57. Atharv Ved: Kaand 14| Sookt 1| Mantr 3

58. Atharv Ved: Kaand 14| Sookt 1| Mantr 4

59.  Atharv Ved: Kaand 14| Sookt 1| Mantr 22

60.Atharv Ved: Kaand 14| Sookt 2| Mantr 25

Atheism can’t win Hinduism/Ved:DSM Satyarthi

Atheism can’t win Hinduism/Ved

DSM Satyarthi


In April 2008, there was an interesting discussion on Ved, Hinduism and atheism.
I reproduce it here, with every word, in original, for the benefit of the interested persons:
Adi from New Delhi wrote:
‘Man you guys suck!!! How stupid is this post. All you stupid Pakis are obsessed about your Islam and your f**ked-up Allah, while all you stupid Indians are obsessed about Hinduism and other shit. Religion SUCKS! It is the biggest destroyer of lives and love in the world. If only religion never existed. Of course it must be noted that however religious the people are, at least India is officially a secular country, while even the Pak govt is obsessed about Islam shit. Racially both India and Pak is the same. It’s not Pak’s fault they got beaten at the wars, India is a bigger and richer country. But all that shit about Indians doing cool science and shit before the west is bullshit. All lies propagated by BJP etc. Me, I am neutral, even though I’m Indian. I don’t give a damn about holy f**king cow gods or shapeless Mohammed-f**ker Allah. All that is BULLSHIT. But at least Indian economy is doing really good, and Indians have the power in their country to protest and select their own govt. We never had a dictator. But I’ll say this for Pakistan, you’ve got some of the HOTTEST girls in the world. You’re doing the world a great disfavour by hiding their faces. Free your women, come on.’

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p16#c346

I commented lightly:
‘Though I differ with you in your views about religion, I love your request :’But I’ll say this for Pakistan, you’ve got some of the HOTTEST girls in the world. You’re doing the world a great disfavour by hiding their faces. Free your women, come on.’

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p16#c347

Indiann Nanaimo, Canada said:
‘They are HOTTEST because

For centuries they have been abducting HOTTEST girls from all over Asia.
And hiding there faces
They are the daughters of the ones they abducted for years.’

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p16#c348

I again commented lightly:
‘I repeat Adi’s request once again:’But I’ll say this for Pakistan, you’ve got some of the HOTTEST girls in the world. You’re doing the world a great disfavour by hiding their faces. Free your women, come on’.’

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p16#c349

Actually, their women are themselves asking for it now:

Muslimahs! Come to India. I recommend Hindu lovers for all the Muslimahs.: Khadeejah Muhammad’:

https://dsms.wordpress.com/2009/01/19/muslimahs-come-to-india-i-recommend-hindu-lovers-for-all-the-muslimahs-khadeejah-muhammad/

True Indian Lorain, OH responded to Adi:
‘Adi from New Delhi wrote:
Man you guys suck!!! How stupid is this post. All you stupid Pakis are obsessed about your Islam and your f**ked-up Allah, while all you stupid Indians are obsessed about Hinduism and other shit. Religion SUCKS! It is the biggest destroyer of lives and love in the world. If only religion never existed. Of course it must be noted that however religious the people are, at least India is officially a secular country, while even the Pak govt is obsessed about Islam shit. Racially both India and Pak is the same. It’s not Pak’s fault they got beaten at the wars, India is a bigger and richer country. But all that shit about Indians doing cool science and shit before the west is bullshit. All lies propagated by BJP etc. Me, I am neutral, even though I’m Indian. I don’t give a damn about holy f**king cow gods or shapeless Mohammed-f**ker Allah. All that is BULLSHIT. But at least Indian economy is doing really good, and Indians have the power in their country to protest and select their own govt. We never had a dictator. But I’ll say this for Pakistan, you’ve got some of the HOTTEST girls in the world. You’re doing the world a great disfavour by hiding their faces. Free your women, come on.

ur father n mother r f..ker…how dare u to write against hindu gods?..u r welcome accept islam..we dont need u in our hinduism..
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV6…

I again commented lightly:
‘How do you know he is really a Hindu?’

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p16#c351

True Indian Lorain, OH responded:
‘If he is not hindu…its really good..We dont want such f..kers in our Hinduism…and if he is not hindu and saying abusing about hindu gods…he has no right to live in India.’

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p16#c352

Adi declared:
‘I am NOT a Hindu. Please don’t insult me by putting me in any religion. I am an out-and-out atheist. My whole family is Hindu, my parents etc etc. and so is everyone else around me. But I am educated and scientific enough to know that religion is bullshit, all religions including hinduism, islam, christianity, sikhism, jainism, judaism etc etc. Why don’t you people realise that GOD DOES NOT EXIST!!! I mean, how can you believe in something that DOES NOT EXIST? I have no right to live in India? Who says India is a Hindu country? India is a SECULAR country, which means even superior people (i.e. atheists) like me who believe in science and not superstitions have a right to live here. And I have the freedom of speech, I can insult any religion I want. Let’s see you insult my religion, i.e. science, True Indian.’

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p16#c353

My response to it:
‘I suspected it from your comments.
I don’t “insult”(?) you by putting you in any religion. Moreover, I congratulate you for being a best son to insult your father, mother and all your family by calling them Hindu.
Great! what an atheist tradition!
Insult your father, insult your mother, insult your family. It is the proof that you are a good atheist.
I congratulate you Mr. Atheist! you are brave enough to kick your father, mother, and family on their butts.
Enjoy the high morals of atheism.
Best of luck.’

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p16#c354

I said to True Indian:
True Indian wrote:
‘If he is not hindu…its really good..We dont want such f..kers in our Hinduism…and if he is not hindu and saying abusing about hindu gods…he has no right to live in India.’

He has confessed now. I told you so already.

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p16#c355

Adi said:
‘Well my parents don’t practice Hinduism. They don’t sit and pray or keep idols etc. But if someone asks them what their religion is, they’ll say Hinduism. I’ll say I don’t have any. Or if you call science, ethics, logic etc religion, those are all mine. I’m not saying calling anyone a Hindu is insulting them. But calling me a Hindu is insulting me.’

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p16#c356

goldendame New Delhi India said:
‘Adi,

I guess you have not understood Hinduism properly. Hinduism is not just praying to God or conducting poojas. I don’t do that either, but I still call myself a staunch Hindu. Reason being, Hinduism is not a religion, it is a way of life.

**********
Hinduism is a way of living according to the one’s understanding of principles of Vedas and Upanishads.

Veda is revealed knowledge. Just as the knowledge of gravity was revealed to Newton, similarly, in India, many Rishis or Seers were awakened to certain transcendental Eternal Truths. These Rishis realized that their real nature was not concerned with or linked with ‘body or mind’, nor was it dependent on sense perceptions, but was in fact identical with the Universal Consciousness.

Upanishad means ‘to sit down near’ because they were explained to the students, who sat at the feet of their teachers. In general Upanishads proclaim salvation by knowledge and realization, rather than by faith and works.

**********

PS: The above 3 paragraphs are a ref from Hindu Forum where someone has written about Hinduism and I found it apt to quote here.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV6…

Hinduism is not just praying to Idols… Hinduism has many branches. Ayurveda, Yoga, Astrology, Astronomy – amongst others are part of Hinduism.

Hinduism is full of logics, you can visit the Hindu forum and discuss the same there.

My response to Adi:
‘Adi from New Delhi wrote:
Well my parents don’t practice Hinduism. They don’t sit and pray or keep idols etc. But if someone asks them what their religion is, they’ll say Hinduism. I’ll say I don’t have any. Or if you call science, ethics, logic etc religion, those are all mine. I’m not saying calling anyone a Hindu is insulting them. But calling me a Hindu is insulting me.’

Sorry! I can’t grasp your logic, Mr. Adi! You say calling you Hindu is insulting to you but not insulting to your parents and family. How is it possible? If the word ‘Hindu’ is insulting like dog or donkey or swine it is insulting to everybody. If it is not so, it is not insulting to you also. Or you feel insulted if you are called wise, brilliant, capable even? What do you think the word ‘Hindu’ means? An idolater? No, it does not. Perhaps you haven’t gone through it’s Sanskr’t dictionary meaning ever. I know. You don’t need it. All the atheists who were born in a Hindu family are fools enough that they lose their logic. They attach one meaning to a word for them and completely another meaning to the same word for others. You are following the same tradition among you so called atheists. What do you know about Hinduism that you hate it so much? I don’t think you know Sanskr’t even and have gone through Ved ever. Do you realize what are you doing? You are hating something which you don’t know even what it is actually in its full form. And you call you are following logic and science!What a joke!
Well, keep it on.
Mr. Adi! I am proud of being Hindu because only Hinduism is the hope for humanity today. Thank Hinduism that has taught its followers to be liberal enough to bear with persons like you.
We Hindus practice religious democracy that even you atheists don’t:

‘RELIGIOUS DEMOCRACY in Hinduism: Ekam sadvipra bahudhaa vadanti’:

https://dsms.wordpress.com/2008/11/15/religious-democracy-in-hinduism-ekam-sadvipra-bahudhaa-vadanti/

We are not fools to hate something we don’t know altogether.
You don’t know Hinduism yet you hate it.
Very brilliant of you!
Isn’t it?’

‘Hinduism is PRINCIPLES BASED , not PERSON BASED’:

‘Whom do I worship?: DSM Satyarthi’

‘Sanyas is not the goal of Hinduism’

‘Socialism in Hinduism’

‘Why Hinduism is IMMORTAL?’

‘One should not wish to die: Ved hates death:DSM Satyarthi

‘Why did Lord Kr’shn marry 16,100 Sheikhzadis?’

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p17#c359

True Indian Lorain, OH responded to Adi:
‘Adi from New Delhi wrote:
I am NOT a Hindu. Please don’t insult me by putting me in any religion. I am an out-and-out atheist. My whole family is Hindu, my parents etc etc. and so is everyone else around me. But I am educated and scientific enough to know that religion is bullshit, all religions including hinduism, islam, christianity, sikhism, jainism, judaism etc etc. Why don’t you people realise that GOD DOES NOT EXIST!!! I mean, how can you believe in something that DOES NOT EXIST? I have no right to live in India? Who says India is a Hindu country? India is a SECULAR country, which means even superior people (i.e. atheists) like me who believe in science and not superstitions have a right to live here. And I have the freedom of speech, I can insult any religion I want. Let’s see you insult my religion, i.e. science, True Indian.

You r alive because of India and Hinduism..if u live in any muslim country u would be probably killed ..and u deserve it…

U cant insult hindu God the reason is it is insulting of 87 crore Hindus….and we dont forgive those who insult us…this is not ur problem…ur parents r fool…they dont know what to teach u ..they did a big mistake by giving born to u..and they will pay it in future.’

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p17#c360

I responded to Adi:
‘Adi from New Delhi wrote:
Well my parents don’t practice Hinduism. They don’t sit and pray or keep idols etc. But if someone asks them what their religion is, they’ll say Hinduism. I’ll say I don’t have any. Or if you call science, ethics, logic etc religion, those are all mine. I’m not saying calling anyone a Hindu is insulting them. But calling me a Hindu is insulting me.

You say:

‘Well my parents don’t practice Hinduism. They don’t sit and pray or keep idols etc. But if someone asks them what their religion is, they’ll say Hinduism.’
It means your parents lie?

Well, how much you continue this great tradition?’

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p17#c361

True Indian Lorain, OH said:
‘Soon Narendra Modi is coming to Delhi and the ppl like u are thrown away to pakistan very soon so be prepare for it….Shame on u and ur parents..

U look like small kid..but where r ur parents…dont they have mind ..they will pay for doing this mistake.’

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p17#c362

I said:
‘goldendame wrote:
<quoted text>
Adi,
I guess you have not understood Hinduism properly. Hinduism is not just praying to God or conducting poojas. I don’t do that either, but I still call myself a staunch Hindu. Reason being, Hinduism is not a religion, it is a way of life.
**********
Hinduism is a way of living according to the one’s understanding of principles of Vedas and Upanishads.
Veda is revealed knowledge. Just as the knowledge of gravity was revealed to Newton, similarly, in India, many Rishis or Seers were awakened to certain transcendental Eternal Truths. These Rishis realized that their real nature was not concerned with or linked with ‘body or mind’, nor was it dependent on sense perceptions, but was in fact identical with the Universal Consciousness.
Upanishad means ‘to sit down near’ because they were explained to the students, who sat at the feet of their teachers. In general Upanishads proclaim salvation by knowledge and realization, rather than by faith and works.
**********
PS: The above 3 paragraphs are a ref from Hindu Forum where someone has written about Hinduism and I found it apt to quote here

Mr. Adi! I wait your scientific criticism over it that you are so proud of. Let’s talk about your atheist logics Mr. Adi! I think all the atheists are fools. Prove me wrong! I invite you.’

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p17#c363

Adi from New Delhi said:
‘I don’t have to prove anything to people who believe in stuff that have no proofs.
Prove you wrong? Prove yourself right. Show me your god. I mean, an earthquake comes, is it seismic waves and release of the earth’s core energy? No, it’s lord shiva angry with humanity or something. Hindus are not secular. You heard what the ‘true indian’ said. Narendra Modi sucks, look at his forehead, covered with ashes or something. Most of the people who are sadhus and stuff aren’t even literate. Whereas none of the highly-educated people practice religion much. We have secularism and democracy because luckily the people who created out national government were educated in the west. I don’t hate Hinduism in particular. I hate all religions in general. Thrown to pakistan? Hahaha. So is India going to become a Hindu country? What the hell are you doing in USA,’true indian’? If India is a Hindu country then US is a christian country, and you’d be very happy if the americans kicked your a** like your great modi is planning to kick mine. Atheists don’t practice democracy? All the great democracies of the world are secular states, eg US, France, Britain, India etc. You are trying too make India into Saudi Arabia, only Hindu instead of Muslin. What difference does that make?’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV6…

‘It’s very simple. The people who don’t mind being called ‘hindu’ like most people around me, calling them hindu is not an insult. For example if I call you a muslim, you’ll get insulted. But calling a muslim a muslim is no big deal. Similarly calling me a hindu is an insult.’

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p17#c365

My response:
‘And why I have to show you my God?

Who do you think you are to ask me for it?

You are using the word my ‘God’. Do you know what is my concept of God?

‘Whom do I worship?’:

https://dsms.wordpress.com/2008/11/17/whom-do-i-worship-dsm-satyarthi/

And yet without knowing even it, you are asking me to show you my God.

You don’t know what I think of God and even then asking me to show Him to you.
This is an example of your so called atheist scientific logic.

You are proving what I said true.

All the atheists are outright fools.

They don’t know even how to logic.’

http://www.topix.com/fAdi from New Delhi wrote:
It’s very simple. The people who don’t mind being called ‘hindu’ like most people around me, calling them hindu is not an insult. For example if I call you a muslim, you’ll get insulted. But calling a muslim a muslim is no big deal. Similarly calling me a hindu is an insult.’

I responded:
‘A second example of stupidity of atheists.

How do you know I feel insulted if you call me a Muslim? How do you know?

You assume it, like all the other foolish atheists assume; and do not try to know.
You assume.
Your atheism is nothing except some foolish assumptions of yours.
Hinduism stands on revelations.
Atheism stands on assumptions!
And they say they have logic and science on their sides.
Great!

If nobody calls you superior you yourself go ahead and pat your back calling you superior!
What a scientific and logical attitude!
Isn’t it?

And isn’t it the third proof that all the atheists are outright fools?’

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p17#c367

Adi from New Delhi wrote:
‘I don’t have to prove anything to people who believe in stuff that have no proofs.
Prove you wrong? Prove yourself right. Show me your god. I mean, an earthquake comes, is it seismic waves and release of the earth’s core energy? No, it’s lord shiva angry with humanity or something. Hindus are not secular. You heard what the ‘true indian’ said. Narendra Modi sucks, look at his forehead, covered with ashes or something. Most of the people who are sadhus and stuff aren’t even literate. Whereas none of the highly-educated people practice religion much. We have secularism and democracy because luckily the people who created out national government were educated in the west. I don’t hate Hinduism in particular. I hate all religions in general. Thrown to pakistan? Hahaha. So is India going to become a Hindu country? What the hell are you doing in USA,’true indian’? If India is a Hindu country then US is a christian country, and you’d be very happy if the americans kicked your a** like your great modi is planning to kick mine. Atheists don’t practice democracy? All the great democracies of the world are secular states, eg US, France, Britain, India etc. You are trying too make India into Saudi Arabia, only Hindu instead of Muslin. What difference does that make?’

I responded:
‘You don’t have to prove because you can’t prove.
How do you know I believe in stuff that have no proof?

How do you know what I believe and what I don’t?
You assume!

Don’t you?
Mr. scientific! Mr. Logical! you assume too much.

You don’t think there is any need to know something before proving it wrong.
How biased you are!
What a scientific and logical attitude of yours!
Salute to your great scientific and logical wisdom! Wow!’

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p17#c368

True Indian Lorain, OH responded to Adi:
‘Adi from New Delhi wrote:
I don’t have to prove anything to people who believe in stuff that have no proofs.
Prove you wrong? Prove yourself right. Show me your god. I mean, an earthquake comes, is it seismic waves and release of the earth’s core energy? No, it’s lord shiva angry with humanity or something. Hindus are not secular. You heard what the ‘true indian’ said. Narendra Modi sucks, look at his forehead, covered with ashes or something. Most of the people who are sadhus and stuff aren’t even literate. Whereas none of the highly-educated people practice religion much. We have secularism and democracy because luckily the people who created out national government were educated in the west. I don’t hate Hinduism in particular. I hate all religions in general. Thrown to pakistan? Hahaha. So is India going to become a Hindu country? What the hell are you doing in USA,’true indian’? If India is a Hindu country then US is a christian country, and you’d be very happy if the americans kicked your a** like your great modi is planning to kick mine. Atheists don’t practice democracy? All the great democracies of the world are secular states, eg US, France, Britain, India etc. You are trying too make India into Saudi Arabia, only Hindu instead of Muslin. What difference does that make?

India is ready to invite all the religion but not its terror…India accept muslims but not terror
India accept christians not their forcibly converstion..
India accepts sikhs but not khalistan movement..

India is secular…but dont bow in front of minorities…This is the face of India…

U r acceptable in Hinduism….and as i told u before too..this is not ur fault…ur parents r biggest fools of the earth who didnt slap u on ur thoughts…so I dont want to talk to u..its not ur fault.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV6…


Adi from New Delhi wrote:
It’s very simple. The people who don’t mind being called ‘hindu’ like most people around me, calling them hindu is not an insult. For example if I call you a muslim, you’ll get insulted. But calling a muslim a muslim is no big deal. Similarly calling me a hindu is an insult.’

True Indian said:
‘We dont want to call u hindu..We dont want to talk to u..We want to talk to ur parents who gave born to u..(shame on ur parents..they cant give their religion to their son..f..kers..)’

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p17#c370

Adi from New Delhi said:
‘I’m not asking you to bow to minorities. Obviously that’s wrong. Obviously terror and forced conversions etc are wrong. But that’s not the debate here. The debate is whether religion is right or not. I don’t really have time to think much about how people prove religion etc. And your parents are the f**kers… let me explain. For eg, when we were both kids, we both would have asked our parents “What is lightning?”. My parents would have said “Lightning is a highly charged bolt of electricity caused by potential difference between rainclouds and the earth’s surface.” Your parents would have said “Lightning is lord indra throwing down his heavenly spears.” Now tell me, which set of parents f**ked their kid up?

I’m an atheist, therefore, I assume nothing. Anything which is proved to me, I believe. As your religion and god and hours of chanting mantra and not eating beef has not got you any tangible results, I refuse to believe in it. Once again, show me proof of god, and I will believe.

Science cannot answer everthing. At least not yet. There are millions of unanswered questions in the universe. But trying to make up answers instead of searching for them (which is what religion is), is hypocracy. Whatever the answers really are, only through science can we know them.’

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p17#c371

‘Of course another very important part of science and logical thinking is freedom. Freedom of thought. Anyone who believes in religion is free to do so. I’m not trying to force you into not doing that. All I’m giving here is my opinion. Which is of course based on material evidence, not on faith on unseen and unfelt powers, gods etc. My opinion is that religion sucks. ANd answer honestly, how many lives would have been saved if religion had never existed?’

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p17#c372

True Indian Lorain, OH said:
‘I m religious that doesnt mean i dont believe in technology…I m technology graduate so dont try to teach me how light is working…My parents r also engineers so they know what is truth…

and u r telling ur parents r hindu so ur grandfather taught ur parents that indra throws light from sky..etc..so ultimately u proved ur grandfathers r f..ker….am i right or u say something wrong??’

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p17#c373

My response to Adi:
‘Adi from New Delhi wrote:
I’m not asking you to bow to minorities. Obviously that’s wrong. Obviously terror and forced conversions etc are wrong. But that’s not the debate here. The debate is whether religion is right or not. I don’t really have time to think much about how people prove religion etc. And your parents are the f**kers… let me explain. For eg, when we were both kids, we both would have asked our parents “What is lightning?”. My parents would have said “Lightning is a highly charged bolt of electricity caused by potential difference between rainclouds and the earth’s surface.” Your parents would have said “Lightning is lord indra throwing down his heavenly spears.” Now tell me, which set of parents f**ked their kid up?
I’m an atheist, therefore, I assume nothing. Anything which is proved to me, I believe. As your religion and god and hours of chanting mantra and not eating beef has not got you any tangible results, I refuse to believe in it. Once again, show me proof of god, and I will believe.
Science cannot answer everthing. At least not yet. There are millions of unanswered questions in the universe. But trying to make up answers instead of searching for them (which is what religion is), is hypocracy. Whatever the answers really are, only through science can we know them.’

I said to it:
‘Well, you are answering True Indian not me.
My questions still hammer on your head.
The only portion I can relate to my questions is this:
‘I’m an atheist, therefore, I assume nothing. Anything which is proved to me, I believe. As your religion and god and hours of chanting mantra and not eating beef has not got you any tangible results, I refuse to believe in it. Once again, show me proof of god, and I will believe.’
Again, assuming many things and still not knowing what you are doing even.

How do you know that my religion, and God, and hours of chanting Mantr and not eating beef has not got me any tangible results?
How do you even know I chant Mantr for hours?
You assume it.
Do you not?
And you call it a scientific and logical attitude.
What a brilliant person your atheism has made you.
Don’t try to know anything about other person before contradicting him, just go on assuming and criticizing your own foolish assumptions about him blindly.
That’s why I call you all atheists foolish.
Keep it on. The wise persons are laughing and enjoying your foolish answers very much.’

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p17#c374

Adi from New Delhi said:
‘I am NOT talking about you in particular, “Humanity”. I am talking about Hinduism as a whole. And ‘True Indian’, my grandparents taught my parents exactly the same things as my parents taught me. It’s just that they don’t mind someone calling them hindu. I do. And if you do believe in science, you’ll know that the answers science and religion give to the same question are often different and contradicting. Which would you believe in such an occasion? In that lightning question, if you do believe in the eletricity explaination, then aren’t you discarding Hinduism?’

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p17#c375

I said:
‘I think you must first answer True Indian as you find his questions easily answerable to you.
We’ll talk when you will finish with him.

It will give you more time to think, if you can, how to answer my questions.
You have written to me:’I am NOT talking about you in particular, “Humanity”. I am talking about Hinduism as a whole.’
O.K. Please tell me what Hinduism is.
As you have so deep knowledge of Hinduism that you are talking about Hinduism as a whole.
I am confessing to you openly with all my senses in proper condition, that I do not know what the whole Hinduism is after all.
You have known it because you are criticizing it.
It will give me some knowledge of Hinduism more that I still do not know.
We Hindus believe:
‘Ananta vai Vedah!”Ved is infinite in knowledge’.

Each and everything which the multiverse has and the existence beyond even multiverse, is described in Ved in its basic form.
‘Sarve Abhihite Vede sarvgyaanmayo hi sah.”Everything is there in Ved. Ved contains the entire knowledge’.’
Principally, where it is possible to extract all the knowledge from Ved, practically it is never possible for any one.

Ved is the knowledge given to us Hinus by the Omnipotent, Omniscient and Almighty.
You know it as a whole!

Very good!
Please enlighten me by answering this simple question–‘What Is Hinduism?’
According to Hinduism why the God made the creations?
Let’s start from the beginning itself.
Okay?
I’m waiting eagerly for your valuable answers.’

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p17#c376

Adi from New Delhi said:
‘Really? So you mean all the vedas arrived by fax from heaven, is it. The four books fell to earth from the skies? No they did not. They were written by the aryans who came to india long ago from central asia and europe. They treated the dravidians (who were more intelligent than them, look at the tamilians) like shit, and they proclaimed that the vedas had come from the almighty. Every religion is like that. Mohammed claimed the quran had been told to him by allah, the bible claims jesus was really the son of god. IT’S NOT TRUE!!! These books were written by MEN, MORTALS THE SAME AS YOU AND I.

I don’t have intricate knowledge about hinduism. I’m not really interested. But I know some of the practices of Hinduism. It’s all around me, India’s full of it. And those practices are useless. They’re all a waste of time. You could spend the time you go to the temple and pray in doing some useful stuff, like studying, or playing football (I hate cricket, but if you like it you can play that too) or teaching, doing business, or creating music, anything valuable, anything that helps your country develop and you prosper. I know a lot about Indian culture, and it’s brilliant. Indian classical music is amazing. But so is so many other cultures. If you seperate culture from religion, you’ll see how much better they are on their own.

I’m sorry but I haven’t read the vedas. I don’t know much about why god (??) created the universe. I have read Ramayana, Mahabharata, the Bible and the Qoran. They’re all wonderfull peices of literature and make very good reading. But that’s all they are. They’re BOOKS. They’re fiction. THEY’RE NOT TRUE.’

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p17#c377

True Indian Lorain, OH said:
‘Adi from New Delhi wrote:
I am NOT talking about you in particular, “Humanity”. I am talking about Hinduism as a whole. And ‘True Indian’, my grandparents taught my parents exactly the same things as my parents taught me. It’s just that they don’t mind someone calling them hindu. I do. And if you do believe in science, you’ll know that the answers science and religion give to the same question are often different and contradicting. Which would you believe in such an occasion? In that lightning question, if you do believe in the eletricity explaination, then aren’t you discarding Hinduism?

Who told u in Hinduism it is written like Indra is throwing light..etc..Did u read it in any religious book?

The technology used at the time of Lord Ram was very much advanced….the ppl on those days also believe in Technology…do u know this?

Religion is the faith of ppl..ppl believe that there is some centre power who is control everything on earth…it is faith of ppl..and u dont have any right to play with it…so shut ur mouth.’

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p18#c378

Adi from New Delhi wrote:
‘Really? So you mean all the vedas arrived by fax from heaven, is it. The four books fell to earth from the skies? No they did not. They were written by the aryans who came to india long ago from central asia and europe. They treated the dravidians (who were more intelligent than them, look at the tamilians) like shit, and they proclaimed that the vedas had come from the almighty. Every religion is like that. Mohammed claimed the quran had been told to him by allah, the bible claims jesus was really the son of god. IT’S NOT TRUE!!! These books were written by MEN, MORTALS THE SAME AS YOU AND I.
I don’t have intricate knowledge about hinduism. I’m not really interested. But I know some of the practices of Hinduism. It’s all around me, India’s full of it. And those practices are useless. They’re all a waste of time. You could spend the time you go to the temple and pray in doing some useful stuff, like studying, or playing football (I hate cricket, but if you like it you can play that too) or teaching, doing business, or creating music, anything valuable, anything that helps your country develop and you prosper. I know a lot about Indian culture, and it’s brilliant. Indian classical music is amazing. But so is so many other cultures. If you seperate culture from religion, you’ll see how much better they are on their own.
I’m sorry but I haven’t read the vedas. I don’t know much about why god (??) created the universe. I have read Ramayana, Mahabharata, the Bible and the Qoran. They’re all wonderfull peices of literature and make very good reading. But that’s all they are. They’re BOOKS. They’re fiction. THEY’RE NOT TRUE.’

I said:
‘Good to find you talking to me at last.
I knew you can’t talk seriously.

No atheist can.

You all go to senseless talks.
For example, who said to you that the Ved is received by fax?

Not me.

You are talking to me yet you are not answering me.

You are still keeping on to assume and assume and assume, and then start answering your foolish assumptions by criticizing them.
You are not the first.

All your colleagues do it.
They enjoy it very much.

They can’t criticizereal Hinduism, so they have devised this unique method:

‘Don’t listen to Hindus ever.

Only pretend to listen to them and while pretending, go on to assume as many foolish things as you can.

When once they stop, you start to reiterate your foolish assumptions imposing them on Hindus and go on criticizing them.’
What a scientific and logical attitude!
And you say you are superior to us!

How?

Shame on you and your foolish comrades.
Why can’t you be true to yourselves at least?

Why can’t you see in the mirror how foolish you are?
Who said you that Ved is received by fax so you are criticizing it?

I certainly did not.
You have foolishly written:
‘The four books fell to earth from the skies? No they did not.’
Who said to you that the four books fell to earth from the sky that you are criticizing it and blessing me with your bounty to tell that ‘No, they did not.’?
What a bounty from you!

We Hindus thought they were received by fax.

The four books fell to earth from the skies.’

Now, you have revealed the greatest fact on us that it was not so.
All the Hindus are so much indebted to your scientific revelation.
Nonsense!

Always assuming foolishly and then criticizing own foolish assumptions!
These are the atheists!
The greatest fools I’ve seen till now!

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p18#c379

‘You have written:

‘They were written by the aryans who came to india long ago from central asia and europe.’

Of course they were writtn by Aryans.

I never said that the God wrote them.

He is beyond doing these silly things.

Even a short lived executive has his steno.

We can’t assume God not to have even that facility or alike.

However, you are talking of history till now not of principles.

History is not Hinduism.

Hinduism has history.

I will not argue with you about the Aryan Invasion theory.

You are too ill informed about it even.

You have not updated yourself and yet you are preaching me foolishly your outdated theories as if they are facts proven.

I won’t argue it because it does not concern our present discussion.

Our present discussion is what is Hinduism.

It does not make any difference whether Aryans came from Central Asia, from outer space or from your own house!

Let them come from anywhere!

I’ll not claim even that they were aboriginal residents of India.

As I say it has no effect on our present discussion.

You just keep on to bring every extraneous matter under discussion as you want.

It’s the foolish strategy all the atheists adopt as they can’t talk to the point.

I am vigilant enough to throw away all the extraneous gibberish to keep you on track.
You have written:

‘I don’t have intricate knowledge about Hinduism. I’m not really interested. But I know some of the practices of Hinduism.’
I knew you can’t talk about Hinduism because you don’t know about it.

You are talking about practices.

Every science and Philosophy has its two components:

‘Theory and Practice’.
Theory is a definite thing and it does not differ from person to person.

Practice depends on lot of things.

The ingenuity of the persons who are practicing it, plays a huge part.

In fact no two persons practice a theory alike.

They are not expected to even.

Practice, as such, differs from person to person.

You call this uncertain thing, ‘Hinduism’?

How brilliant of you!
Hinduism has its theory part in Ved.

And, for your kind information Mr. Atheist! The Hinduism is what the Ved tells us.
You haven’t read Ved.

So actually you don’t even know what Hinduism is.
You hate certain practices that differ everywhere.

You can do that.

I myself hate a lot of them.

I myself criticize openly lots of them that they are outright against Ved.

I don’t think I’m doing any harm to Hinduism.

On the contrary, I think I’m serving Hinduism far better than its so called other practitioners.’

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p18#c380

Adi from New Delhi said:
‘I don’t get it. You’re critizing yet being so general. You never point out anything specific. You’re always saying I’m so illogical etc. I qoute you:

“Principally where it is possible to extract all the knowledge from Ved, practically it is never possible for any one.

Ved is the knowledge given to us Hindus by the Omnipotent, Omniscient and Almighty.”

You really thought I meant fax as in fax, the machine?

I was using a similie.

I was saying that, contrary to what you said, Ved was not given to Hindus by the “Omipotent, Ominiscient and Almighty”. It was written by the Hindus themselves.

I agree many practices may not be part of the original Hinduism.

Yet if Hinduism (or any other religion) had never existed, nobody would have any excuse for the practices. No women would have been burnt in sati, no man would have died in bloody riots, no partition would have taken place, no 9/11 would have happened.

Religion is ALL in the mind.

There has never been any natural evidence to support any practices of any religion.

If people would have searched for natural truth (which is what science is), we would have been far more advanced a world than we are now.

And you yourself know that as more and more is being known about nature, more deseases are being cured, the inherent NEED for religion and a belief in god of man is eroding.

Religion is slowly being wiped out.

It is happening much more fast in the west, but even in India, especially among the urban middle class, the trend of abandoning religion and embracing logic is growing.

For example (I’m quoting from Wikipedia), 70% of Britain claimed they were not affiliated to any religious group, and only 33% said they ‘believed in a god’.

This has to happen.

Religion is an outdated concept.

It cannot last.’

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p18#c381

I said:
‘You are not specific yourself.

How the answer could be specific?

However, nothing is lost even now!

We can discuss further.
You write:
‘You really thought I meant fax as in fax, the machine? I was using a similie. I was saying that, contrary to what you said, Ved was not given to Hindus by the “Omipotent, Ominiscient and Almighty”. It was written by the Hindus themselves.’
That’s what I mean.
It’s the theory you atheists have developed.

Yet, you treat and want us theists, to accept it as fact.
Why do you  think us fools, while the foolish acts are being done by you atheists, yourselves?

Mind you! I am using plural, not particularly you.
Lenin started it as a policy not to hear theists when they criticize the atheism.
He had especially instructed his followers not to join any argument with the theists if they talk with rationality and logic.
They must be criticized irrespective of how rational and logical they might be.
He instructed them logic with them when they are illogical and don’t logic with them when they are logical.
If you had gone through all the writings of Lenin you would have find it.

If you have not, you should, as Lenin was one of the most successful atheists.

Though, his atheism was not behind his success, it was his ingenuity.
You claim to be a person of scientific attitude yet you resort to simile when we start argument.
I have written:
‘You have written : ‘They were written by the aryans who came to india long ago from central asia and europe.’

Of course they were written by Aryans.

I never said that the God wrote them.

He is beyond doing these silly things.

Even a short lived executive has his steno. We can’t assume God not to have even that facility or alike.’
It was a complete answer to you in the matter, yet you repeat it again.
What do you mean?
We should accept your foolish theories as universal facts?

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p18#c384

‘You write:
‘I was saying that, contrary to what you said, Ved was not given to Hindus by the “Omipotent, Ominiscient and Almighty”. It was written by the Hindus themselves.’
How do you know?
What proof you have for it?
You think all our Rishis were liars?
Only you atheists are truthful?
I can’t buy it.
When we compare the characters of our Rishis and that of you atheists we find them more truthful than you persons are.
It is observed, in practice, that the liars make theft of others’ successful literary work and produce them as their own.
I haven’t seen a person who write as beautiful and as eternal literature as Ved and instead claiming the credit for it gives the credit to others.
Nobody does it.
However you are claiming it is the case in the matter.
How can I believe?
How many books have you written, or your friends, and attributed to others?
How many articles have you written or your friends and attributed to others?
How many poems have you written, or your friends, and attributed to others?
My dear friend! No one is as mad as  to do it.
Yet, you want me to believe this already super flop, rejected, and outdated crazy theory of Marx and Lenin?
Ved is a large literary and humanistic work.
It consists of more than even 20,000 verses.
This great literary and humanistic work was done and its writers did not claim they had written it.
They attributed it to God.
They claimed they saw it, not conceived.
It is not theirs.
It is given to them.
This alone act tells to any sane person that they were telling the truth.
The same writers who claimed that Ved were given to them, have written other books.
Those other books even lose the multiversal eternal concept and profound humanity we find in Ved.
These other books lack the depth Ved has.
How can it be if the Ved and the other books are from the same source?
A writer revises, improves himself in his later work more and more.

later work of the same Rishis must outexcel Ved more and more.
We find the case is not as such.
Ved outexcels on all the later Aryan work.
It itself establishes beyond all doubt that Ved is not their work.
So, my dear friend! you are quite mistaken.’

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p18#c385

Adi from New Delhi wrote:
‘Of course another very important part of science and logical thinking is freedom. Freedom of thought. Anyone who believes in religion is free to do so. I’m not trying to force you into not doing that. All I’m giving here is my opinion. Which is of course based on material evidence, not on faith on unseen and unfelt powers, gods etc. My opinion is that religion sucks. ANd answer honestly, how many lives would have been saved if religion had never existed?’

I said:
‘You write:
‘My opinion is that religion sucks. ANd answer honestly, how many lives would have been saved if religion had never existed?’
And, similarly, if we extend your logic, how many lives would have been saved if Communism never existed!
Evidently, Communism is not a religion, at least the Communists don’t claim so.
It did not last even 75 years.
It could not complete even a century.
Yet, the lives, it did cost, were thousands of millions.’

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p19#c401

Adi from New Delhi wrote:
‘Of course another very important part of science and logical thinking is freedom. Freedom of thought. Anyone who believes in religion is free to do so. I’m not trying to force you into not doing that. All I’m giving here is my opinion. Which is of course based on material evidence, not on faith on unseen and unfelt powers, gods etc. My opinion is that religion sucks. ANd answer honestly, how many lives would have been saved if religion had never existed?’

I said:
‘You have written:
‘Of course another very important part of science and logical thinking is freedom. Freedom of thought.’
Communism does not believe in freedom of thought.
Go to the entire history of Soviet Empire which could not complete even a 3/4 century.
Through out its tenure the very first thing it snatched out of its people was the very freedom of thought you are talking of.’

Hinduism believes in Religious democracy, however.

‘RELIGIOUS DEMOCRACY in Hinduism: Ekam sadvipra bahudhaa vadanti’.

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p19#c402

Adi from New Delhi wrote:
It’s very simple. The people who don’t mind being called ‘hindu’ like most people around me, calling them hindu is not an insult. For example if I call you a muslim, you’ll get insulted. But calling a muslim a muslim is no big deal. Similarly calling me a hindu is an insult.’

I said:
‘Let me clear myself.
While going through this discussion again, I realized that perhaps I haven’t written anywhere what the true meaning of the word ‘Hindu’ according to Sanskr’t dictionary.
As none asked me perhaps I let it go at that.
Please allow me to provide the necessity.
According to Standard Sanskr’t Dictionaries,’Hindu’means:
‘Hindurdushtnr’h prokto’nary’neetividooshakah,
Saddharmpalako vidvan Shrautdharmparayanah’
‘A Hindu is called to be the one who never compromises with the wicked. He destroys the policies against humanism. He practices the system of life that is noble. He is intelligent and learned. He par excelles in the system of life described in Ved.’

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p19#c403

Adi said:
‘I agree many practices may not be part of the original Hinduism. Yet if Hinduism (or any other religion) had never existed, nobody would have any excuse for the practices. No women would have been burnt in sati, no man would have died in bloody riots, no partition would have taken place, no 9/11 would have happened.’

I said:
‘Hinduism did not say to follow corrupt practices.
In democracy, the malpractitioner candidates appeal to caste, creed, and selfish desires of certain groups of voters.
By extending your reasoning, one can claim: ‘If Democracy did not exist no malpractitioner candidate would have appealed to caste, creed and selfish desires to the voters, and would have divided the humanity.’
Do you think this reasoning correct?
Certainly not.
Then how what you say make Hinduism responsible for malpractices of its so called followers?
Why only followers are not responsible for what they did?
Why Hinduism in Principle?
Hinduism never preached them those malpractices.’

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p19#c405

Adi from New Delhi wrote:
‘I don’t get it. You’re critizing yet being so general. You never point out anything specific. You’re always saying I’m so illogical etc. I qoute you:
“Principally where it is possible to extract all the knowledge from Ved, practically it is never possible for any one. Ved is the knowledge given to us Hinus by the Omnipotent, Omniscient and Almighty.”
You really thought I meant fax as in fax, the machine? I was using a similie. I was saying that, contrary to what you said, Ved was not given to Hindus by the “Omipotent, Ominiscient and Almighty”. It was written by the Hindus themselves.
I agree many practices may not be part of the original Hinduism. Yet if Hinduism (or any other religion) had never existed, nobody would have any excuse for the practices. No women would have been burnt in sati, no man would have died in bloody riots, no partition would have taken place, no 9/11 would have happened.
Religion is ALL in the mind. There has never been any natural evidence to support any practices of any religion. If people would have searched for natural truth (which is what science is), we would have been far more advanced a world than we are now. And you yourself know that as more and more is being known about nature, more deseases are being cured, the inherent NEED for religion and a belief in god of man is eroding. Religion is slowly being wiped out. It is happening much more fast in the west, but even in India, especially among the urban middle class, the trend of abandoning religion and embracing logic is growing.
For example (I’m quoting from Wikipedia), 70% of Britain claimed they were not affiliated to any religious group, and only 33% said they ‘believed in a god’.
This has to happen. Religion is an outdated concept. It cannot last.

‘I agree many practices may not be part of the original Hinduism. Yet if Hinduism (or any other religion) had never existed, nobody would have any excuse for the practices. No women would have been burnt in sati, no man would have died in bloody riots, no partition would have taken place, no 9/11 would have happened.’

I said:

‘Interesting! What a logic!
If there were no nuclear science, there were no atom bomb, no Hiroshima, no Nagasaki, no terrorist country could have nuclear weapon. If there were no science, there were no nuclear science even!
I wonder whether I am talking to even a sane person!’

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p19#c409

Adi from New Delhi wrote:
‘I don’t get it. You’re critizing yet being so general. You never point out anything specific. You’re always saying I’m so illogical etc. I qoute you:
“Principally where it is possible to extract all the knowledge from Ved, practically it is never possible for any one. Ved is the knowledge given to us Hinus by the Omnipotent, Omniscient and Almighty.”
You really thought I meant fax as in fax, the machine? I was using a similie. I was saying that, contrary to what you said, Ved was not given to Hindus by the “Omipotent, Ominiscient and Almighty”. It was written by the Hindus themselves.
I agree many practices may not be part of the original Hinduism. Yet if Hinduism (or any other religion) had never existed, nobody would have any excuse for the practices. No women would have been burnt in sati, no man would have died in bloody riots, no partition would have taken place, no 9/11 would have happened.
Religion is ALL in the mind. There has never been any natural evidence to support any practices of any religion. If people would have searched for natural truth (which is what science is), we would have been far more advanced a world than we are now. And you yourself know that as more and more is being known about nature, more deseases are being cured, the inherent NEED for religion and a belief in god of man is eroding. Religion is slowly being wiped out. It is happening much more fast in the west, but even in India, especially among the urban middle class, the trend of abandoning religion and embracing logic is growing.
For example (I’m quoting from Wikipedia), 70% of Britain claimed they were not affiliated to any religious group, and only 33% said they ‘believed in a god’.
This has to happen. Religion is an outdated concept. It cannot last.’

I said:

‘Religion is ALL in the mind.’
Science is also not elsewhere.
If you are really a science student perhaps you have come across the statements of renowned scientists that in quantum theory and atomic theory the mental condition of the scientist plays a huge part.
Why is it so if these theories are not ‘all in mind’?’

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TV63PGE6BCKQTR8LM/p19#c410

‘We Hindus practice religious democracy that even you atheists don’t.’

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/TK4C9MBC2CTRIGT42

‘70% of Britain claimed they were not affiliated to any religious group, and only 33% said they ‘believed in a god’.’

It’s in Britain, because Britain is not a Hindu dominated nation.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Britain
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Kingdom
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Kingdom#O…
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Kingdom#C…
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Kingdom#E…

I’m sorry to say that Christianity is not capable to face atheism.
However, it does not mean that Hinduism does also suffer the same weaknesses as Christianity does.

http://www.topix.com/forum/religion/hindu/T9NFQK5E77ANU5R13

Adi says:

It’s not Pak’s fault they got beaten at the wars, India is a bigger and richer country.’

I’m again sorry to disagree with our Mr. Adi here too.

India is bigger and richer, is not a fact unknown to anyone.

Naturally, every Government of Pakistan, irrespective of the fact whosoever it may be, knows the fact too.

Then why it fights with India at all?

That’s why its Pak’s fault, Mr. Adi, not anyone else’s.

Keep your sense of justice on the right track, at least,  if not the rest of your senses.

You say you are impartial.

Be justified too.

Thanks for bearing with me so long.

—————————————————————————————

More on Hinduism from DSM Satyarthi:

1. ‘Bhoorbhuvah svah!’ ‘The Existence! The Consciousness! The Bliss!’

2.‘Devasy’ pashy’ kaavyam, n’ mamaar, n’ jeeryati.’

3. Hinduism shines

4.Ved is the eternal law book having infinite knowledge in it for human beings

5. ‘According to facts’: ‘Yaathaatathyatah’

6. ‘SET THIS WOMAN for WELL DOER’: ‘Imaam naareem Sukr’te dadhaat’

7. The Evernew Hinduism: Yaathaatathyatah: Ved 2|40|8

8. ‘How to cross death’: ‘Tamev viditvaati mr’tyumeti’: Ved2Yajurved|31|18

9. According to Hinduism: We must be polite, not coward

10.Ye yathaa maam prapadyante taanstathaiv bhajaamyaham: Lord Kr’shn

11. ‘Maachchhitthaa asmaallokaat’ ‘Be not severed from this world’: Ved

12. The mental slavery of the English-educated Indians

——————————————————————————————————————–-

More on Islam from DSM Sayarthi:

1. Bal huv qur’anum majeedun fe LAUHIM MAHFOOZIN

2. Innahu laquranun kareemun Fee kitabin maknoonin

3. ‘Hudallilmuttaqeen’: ‘Guidance for controllers of organs’: 2 Al Baqarah: 2

4. ‘Alaa qalbik litakoon minal-munzireen’ ‘upon your heart one of who to warn’

5. Muslimahs! Come to India. I recommend Hindu lovers for all the Muslimahs.: Khadeejah Muhammad

6. Islam according to Qur’an and Maulana Maududi rahamatullh alaihi

7. A Moment of grave thinking for the entire sophisticated Muslim Community

8. ‘SET THIS WOMAN for WELL DOER’: ‘Imaam naareem Sukr’te dadhaat’

9. ‘V’ innahu fe UMMALKITAABI ladainaa la’liyyun hakeemun’: 43/4

10. Most Present day Muslms don’t do what Huzoor(SAW) did:

11. The Muslim beauties are wooing Hindu men FASTEST

12. ‘What really matters in the sight of God’: Maulana: Maududi

13. Why did Islam face a counter revolution at Karbala?

14. Why there are differences among us?

15. No differences Please!

16. Communal Muslims discuss my Muslim wife, me and my Muslim women: Durgesh

———————————————————————

Commentary on Ved from DSM Satyarthi:

1. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 1| Mantr 1

2. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 1| Mantr 2

3. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 5| Mantr 3

4. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 5| Mantr 3

5. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 7| Mantr 5

6. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 7| Mantr 8

4. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 19| Mantr 1

5. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 19| Mantr 2

6. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 19| Mantr 3

7. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 19| Mantr 4

8. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 19| Mantr 5

9. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 19| Mantr 6

10. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 19| Mantr 7

11. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 19| Mantr 8

12.R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 19| Mantr 9

13. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 58| Mantr 6

14. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 164| Mantr 20

15. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 164| Mantr 46

16. R’gved: Mandal 2| Sookt 1| Mantr 1

17 R’gved: Mandal 3| Sookt 1| Mantr 1

18. R’gved: Mandal 3| Sookt 6| Mantr 2

19. R’gved: Mandal 4| Sookt 1| Mantr 1

20. R’gved: Mandal 5| Sookt 1| Mantr 1

21. R’gved: Mandal 6| Sookt 1| Mantr 1

22. R’gved: Mandal 7| Sookt 1| Mantr 1

23. R’gved: Mandal 8| Sookt 1| Mantr 1

24. R’gved: Mandal 9| Sookt 1| Mantr 1

25. R’gved: Mandal 9| Sookt 63| Mantr 4-5

26. R’gved: Mandal 10| Sookt 1| Mantr 1

27. R’gved: Mandal 10| Sookt 85| Mantr 42

28. Yajurved: Adhyaay’ 1| Mantr 1

29. Yajurved: Adhyaay’ 1| Mantr 2

30. Yajurved: Adhyaay’ 1| Mantr 3

31. Yajurved: Adhyaay’ 1| Mantr 4

32. Yajurved: Adhyaay’ 11| Mantr 1

33. Yajurved: Adhyaay’ 13| Mantr 4

34. Yajurved: Adhyaay’ 23| Mantr 3

35. Yajurved: Adhyaay’ 40| Mantr8

36. Saamved: Mantr 1

37. Sāmved: Mantr 115

38. Sāmved: Mantr 641: Mahānāmnyārchik| 1

39. Sāmved: Mantr 650: Mahānāmnyārchik| 10

40. Sāmved: Mantr 651: Uttarārchik

41. Atharv Ved: Kaand 1| Sookt 1| Mantr 1

42.  Atharv Ved: Kānd 3| Sookt 30| Mantr 3

43. Atharv Ved: Kānd 3| Sookt 30| Mantr 4

44. Atharv Ved: Kānd 3| Sookt 30| Mantr 6

45. Atharv Ved: Kānd 4| Sookt 4| Mantr 6

46. Atharv Ved: Kānd 4| Sookt 4| Mantr 7

47. Atharv Ved: Kānd 4| Sookt 4| Mantr 8

48. Atharv Ved: Kaand 8| Sookt 1| Mantr 6

49. Atharv Ved: Kaand 14| Sookt 1| Mantr 22

50.Atharv Ved: Kaand 14| Sookt 2| Mantr 25