Most Present day Muslims don’t do
what Ħuzūrsaw did
DSM Satyarthi
Most Present day Muslims believe that they do what Huzoor(SAW) did.
I don’t think it true.
If it had been, the most of the humankind would have been Muslim.
They were not hating Islam, as they are hating it today.
I’ve already discussed the subject matter somewhere else:
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81
Salman wrote:
<quoted text>
‘Islam does not believe in rebirth, but only resurrection and the Last Judgment Day. In contrast to Islam, Hinduism considers life in heaven and hell as temporary. A soul regains freedom forever only through self-realization.
In Islam there is no concept of Trinity. God is one and indivisible. Hinduism recognizes three highest functional aspects of God in the form of Brahma, Vishnu and Siva, who are called the Three Deities (Trimurthis),depicted either as one or separate deities, who carry out the three primary functions of God’s manifestation, namely creation, preservation and destruction.
Hazrat Muhammad (SAW) set an example to crush the idols. So being a Hindu, can u do this?’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p19#c444
I replied:
‘You have enlisted here three major differences:
1. Rebirth.
2.Trinity.
3. Crushing of idols.
I will reverse them in order as I have already answered the last one but you have repeated the same nevertheless.
I am unable to understand why did you do it.
When I have already answered a question either you should show your disagreement with my answer in detail that why do you disagree with me in the matter, or accept that my answer has answered you completely.
You haven’t adopted either attitude.
Instead, you just go on and repeat your question almost word to word.
I had answered:
‘Hindu tradition differs here profoundly.
We respect what Huzoor(S) did.
He was the apostle of the God.
He did know better what he(S) was doing.
We, the normal persons; do not have any right to criticize the great revolutionist(S) of his time.
We should only try to understand what he did and why he would have done it.
Then we should follow him(S) according to Al Qur’an Al Majeed.
We do not have any right to contradict or criticize him(S).
He(S) was bestowed with Meraj. We are not.
He(S) knew more than us.
He(S)sacrificed his life fighting against evil.
Nevertheless, Hindu tradition differs here.
Mind you! I’m telling Hindu tradition! not Hinduism!
There are many persons who are adamant that every Hindu tradition is Hinduism.
I don’t.
Hindu tradition is to explain the person what the real truth is. Explain him/her everything in quite detail.
But never compel him to do anything against her/his wishes.
We convince one that idol worship is not preached in Ved.
Ved preaches Meditation.
We explain what is wrong in idol worship and what is better in meditation.
Yet, the ultimate decision rests with her/him.
We do not compel anyone to change one’s faith.
We never insist.
He/she has her/his own reasoning.
We will discuss with one for years, but will never compel.
The decision must be hers/his.
It does not mean that we criticize Huzoor(s) for His(S) crushing of idols.
No! We don’t think we have any right to.
He(S) understood more what he(S) did.
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p19#c448
Salman, Karachi, Pakistan wrote:
‘Hazrat Muhammad (SAW) didn’t have any version of Islam. He had the true Islam and he didn’t compromise on truth and kept on following Allah’s commands even though he was brutally beaten by Mushrikins but he kept on preaching Islam.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p19#c461
Salman, Karachi, Pakistan wrote further:
‘You don’t have to say sorry. Actually I like this conversation, any ways you said
“Similarly, I believe Islam is what Qur’ano ahadeese muqaddasat tell us, not what Muslims believe, do and practice”.
What Muslims do is according to Islam. There are things which they don’t practice (which is wrong) but Islam is not just a religion it is a complete code of life and as a Muslim you have to implement Islam in your life for example if you don’t offer prayers means that you are saying. that “ok I believe on Islam but I don’t want to offer prayers and I believe that offering prayers means that I m showing that I m a Muslim where as it is better to be a Muslim from Inside”.
Similarly if you don’t practice Hinduism that is also wrong if you are a Hindu.
About Namaz Hazrat Muhammad (SAW) said that “the only difference between a believer and a non-believer is Namaz”.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p18#c424
I replied AAAA:
‘You have written:
then you are a communist or you are living in a confused state, Make up your mind?’
I am unable to follow your reasoning!
Do you know what a communist is?
I am confident you don’t.
I am giving you a web address. Click it to know what a communist is first, then we will discuss on this point:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communist
‘or you are living in a confused state.’
No! I am not! I am quite clear! There is no confusion at all.
My mind is already made up.
‘And whoever contradicts and opposes the Messenger (Muhammad, Peace Be
Upon Him) after the right path has been shown clearly to him.’
I am neither contradicting nor opposing Huzoor(S).
‘The Jews say that the Christians have nothing and the Christians say that the Jews have nothing of it, though both read the Scripture. And those who have no knowledge of the Scripture also make similar claims. Allah will surely give His judgment on the Day of Resurrection in all the matters in which they differ.’
–Al Qur’an Al Kareem: 2 Al Baqarah: 113
‘The fact is that no one has any special claim to Paradise; whoever surrenders himself to Allah in obedience and follows the Right Way, shall get his reward from his Lord: there shall be neither fear nor grief for such people.’
—Al Qur’an Al Kareem: 2 Al Baqarah: 112
‘wala taa’saw fil-arzi mufsideen.’
‘Do not spread disorder on earth.’
—Al Qur’an Al Majeed 2 Al Baqarah: 60.
‘Whenever it is said to them, “Spread not disorder on the earth”, their reply is, “We only seek to put things aright”.
–Al Qur’an Al Kareem: 2 Al Baqarah: 11
‘Beware! They do spread disorder but they realize it not.’
—Al Qur’an Al Kareem: 2 Al Baqarah: 12
I believe Allah knows better what is Islam than you.
Sorry to differ with you altogether in the matter.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p18#c425
Salman wrote:
‘Durgesh!
You always talk about your PhD wife but tell me does she possess more knowledge than the Ulamas who have given all of their lives in Islamic studies?’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p19#c445
He argued further:
‘You have quoted this aayat:
‘The fact is that no one has any special claim to Paradise; whoever surrenders himself to Allah in obedience and follows the Right Way, shall get his reward from his Lord: there shall be neither fear nor grief for such people.’
—Al Qur’an Al Kareem: 2 Al Baqarah: 112
Surrendering in front of Allah means to obey him in the similar way which Allah had told you. And not by picking different things from different religions. Reading between the lines is always dangerous.
‘Beware! They do spread disorder but they realize it not.’
—Al Qur’an Al Kareem: 2 Al Baqarah: 12
Personal interpretation of a religion just to satisfy my wants is that disorder which is being prohibited by Allah.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
He argued to Sidrah:
‘Sidra!
You didn’t condemn the title of this thread, never showed any concerns over it and never gave your justifications which surely disgrace you as well.
It’s shocking, hurting and surprising!’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p19#c447
AAAA wrote:
‘Durgesh jabalpur wrote:
‘
Great! Akbar was stupid for this proudy stupid Arab.’
!
‘you are calling me a stupied Arab, it. this is the job of clever people?
Anti-Christian Hate Campaigns Fuel Persecution in India
(September 25, 2007) The Washington, DC based human rights group, International Christian Concern (ICC) www.persecution.org has learned that Hindu extremist groups have actively been campaigning against Christians for close to a decade, yet there is little the government has done to check what continues to fuel India’s worst incidents of religious persecution.
Often, reporting on Christian persecution in India tends to focus on the incidents, and not the causes, of persecution. Rarely do we see the big picture – that Hindu ultra-nationalists who believe that to be Indian means to be Hindu are taking advantage of the uneducated and waging a hate-filled propaganda campaign against Christians.
Most recently, Hindu extremist groups Bajrang Dal and Hindu Jagruti Samiti distributed thousands of anti-Christian leaflets in Chitradurga district in the southern state of Karnataka last month. This campaign resulted in an incident on August 5, when at least 50 extremists attacked more than 10 workers of the Seventh Day Adventist church during the dedication of a new church in Sira area between Tumkur and Chitradurga districts. On August 16, the victimized Christian workers were arrested on charges of “forcible conversion.”
The trend of launching venomous propaganda campaigns that incite physical attacks against the Christian minority came to fore in 1998 when the Hindu-nationalist Bharatiya Janata Party (BJP), the political arm of the chief Hindu extremist organization, Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sangh (RSS), graduated from a party on the margins to a mainstream and ruling party in India.
Soon after the BJP’s accession to power, there was a spate of violence against Christians from December 25, 1998, through January 3, 1999, in the Dangs district of Gujarat state. These attacks included the killing of priests and the raping of nuns to the physical destruction of Christian schools, churches, colleges, and cemeteries. Hundreds of Christians were also forced to “reconvert” to Hinduism. The outbreak of violence in Dangs is typical of how anti-Christian violence is organized in various parts of the country.
According to a report by the Human Rights Watch,“Politics by Other Means: Attacks against Christians in India,” the extremist group Hindu Jagran Manch (HJM) obtained permission to hold a rally on December 25, 1998 in Ahwa town in the Dangs district. Over 4,000 people participated in the rally, shouting anti-Christian slogans while the police stood by and watched. After the rally, the attacks began on Christian places of worship, schools run by missionaries, and shops owned by Christians.
In another incident, Hindu villagers, with the encouragement of a village chief, gang-raped two Christian women after their families refused to denounce Christianity on May 28, 2006 in Nadia village in Bhagwanpura block in Madhya Pradesh state’s Khargone district. A fact-finding report noted,“There have been several attacks against the Christian community since 2003, but the intensity of persecutions increased since May 21, 2006, followed by a rally organized by the Vanvasi Kalyan Ashram (organization for welfare of tribal people).”
Given that hate campaigns and consequent attacks polarize people along religious lines, the BJP, which portrays itself as the “protector” of Hindus, benefits politically.
ICC research noted that hate campaigns attract several local laws, and yet the media – both local and international, the state and federal governments in India as well as international organizations have a tendency to take note only of “violent incidents” while failing to address the backdrop against which such incidents takes place.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p19#c452
I said:
‘What did you expect from me when you called all my country people Stupid people?
‘you country people now akber, badshah and all that stupied people .’
Did you expect I will be glad that you have called all my country people Stupid and will announce that ‘I love you for your great love for me and my country people?
You used first this word ‘Stupid’ and now you yourself are complaining for it?
What an attitude!
Great manners!
My country people were not talking to you.
What was the context to call all my country people Stupid?
If one abuses someone, that one should be prepared to be abused.
Instead, the entire Internet Community can appreciate my civilized reaction that I have called Stupid only you, not all your country people.
They can’t be held responsible for your attitude.
Nevertheless, I did not mean it.
It was only to show you and make you realize that you should not have done it.
I’m sorry! I don’t think you are really stupid. It were bad manners in response to your bad manners!
I am profoundly sorry that I had to resort to that attitude.
You did not leave another option for me.
Sorry again nevertheless!
Now, why have you written that long passage?
You have not clarified it.
If you think I advocate all those inhuman activities of the so called Hindus, you are quite wrong.
I don’t.
However, I don’t know the full details.
As such, I am not a suitable person to comment on it.
If the incidences happened as you described, it is inhumane and barbaric, but my experience is that the media is generally anti Hindu in the matters.
I’m giving two links here.
If you like to go on the matter, you may click the links and can understand what I mean by it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Hinduism
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Brahminism
‘or you are living in a confused state.’
No! I am not! I am quite clear! There is no confusion at all.
My mind is already made up.
‘And whoever contradicts and opposes the Messenger (Muhammad, Peace Be
Upon Him) after the right path has been shown clearly to him.’
I am neither contradicting nor opposing Huzoor(S).
‘The Jews say that the Christians have nothing and the Christians say that the Jews have nothing of it, though both read the Scripture. And those who have no knowledge of the Scripture also make similar claims. Allah will surely give His judgment on the Day of Resurrection in all the matters in which they differ.’
—Al Qur’an Al Kareem: 2 Al Baqarah: 113
‘The fact is that no one has any special claim to Paradise; whoever surrenders himself to Allah in obedience and follows the Right Way, shall get his reward from his Lord: there shall be neither fear nor grief for such people.’
—Al Qur’an Al Kareem: 2 Al Baqarah: 112
‘wala taa’saw fil-arzi mufsideen.’
‘Do not spread disorder on earth.’
—Al Qur’an Al Majeed 2 Al Baqarah: 60.
‘Whenever it is said to them, “Spread not disorder on the earth”, their reply is, “We only seek to put things aright”.
—Al Qur’an Al Kareem: 2 Al Baqarah: 11
‘Beware! They do spread disorder but they realize it not.’
—Al Qur’an Al Kareem: 2 Al Baqarah: 12
I believe Allah knows better what is Islam than you.
Sorry to differ with you altogether in the matter.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p18#c425
I replied to Salman Karachi:
‘You have written:
‘What Muslims do is according to Islam.’
Here again we go around in circles.
The key question is who is Muslim?
Whether you will define a Muslim, or Allah?
Whether you will reward Jannat in Aakhirat, or Allah?
Allah says:
‘The fact is that no one has any special claim to Paradise; whoever surrenders himself to Allah in obedience and follows the Right Way, shall get his reward from his Lord: there shall be neither fear nor grief for such people.’
—Al Qur’an Al Kareem: 2Al Baqarah:112
His certificate is more than enough for me and is above all the rest of the certificates.
I do not have to obey Muslims or the persons who are too proud of being so called Muslims, whether they are actually Muslims or not.
You have written:
‘as a Muslim you have to implement Islam in your life.’
How do you know I don’t?’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p18#c425
Sidrah Bombay, India said:
‘Salman wrote:
‘About Namaz Hazrat Muhammad (SAW) said that “the only difference between a believer and a non-believer is Namaz”.’
‘So in that case, you do agree that a person who observes salat is not a kaafir, right?’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p18#c427
AAAA wrote:
<quoted text>
‘The name hindu is given by a muslim you can read you counrty history if you want.in the book “discovery of india”. and one of indian writer viveknanda has also mention that name ‘hindu plays a misnoma. the actual name should be “Vedantist”. the people who lived on the other side of the river Indus are called HINDUS. that is what is your country history, so make up your mind. don’t be hypocrites and think with a open Mind.’
I replied:
Shabd Kalpdrum/Raamkosh is more ancient than the Muslims.
How a name given by a Muslim, could be included in Shabd Kalpdrum/Raamkosh?
Your claim is, therefore, wrong.
Mr. Jawaharlal Nehru was mistaken if he
wrote that in ‘Discovery of India’.
The book is already outdated and needs updation very badly.
Anyway Shabd Kalpdrum/Raamkosh are more ancient than Muslims . AND Muslims are more ancient than Jawaharlal Nehru.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
Moreover, I congratulated Sidrah:
‘Bravo Sidrah! Congratulations for asking the key question.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
Salman said:
‘Neither I am criticizing you nor am I saying that I will decide that who should be awarded the ‘Jannat’. What I want to say is that for a Muslim it is necessary to leave other religion he should be only a Muslim other wise he is a communist or what ever. That’s the reason why I gave the example of Namaz.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p18#c430
Sidrah Bombay, India asked:
‘Tell me, is there any PM feature supported on this board?’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p18#c433
I replied:
‘I don’t know.However get my email address:
satyaryhi.dsm@gmail.com
You are most welcome.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p18#c436
To Salman, I replied:
‘I can’t understand whether you belong to Islam or communism.
You are telling me either tell to you what you want me to tell you or I’m a communist.
why are you trying your best to throw away a person to communism who claims to be a Muslim?
You persons do not understand what communism is even.
Please click to the link below and study carefully what communism is first. Then we can discuss properly on my being a communist or not:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communist
You have written:
‘it is necessary to leave other religion he should be only a Muslim other wise he is a communist or what ever.’
Which other religion, Salman Sahab?
I have already written:
‘As per Ved and Qur’an Hinduism and Islam are not two religions.
Ved is everfirst book of Islam and Qur’an is according to its claim the last book of Hinduism.
‘innallazeen aamanoo vallazeen haadoo vannasaaraa vassaabieen man aaman billaahi val yaumil aakhiri wa amil saalihan f’ lahum ajruhum ind rabbihim wa laa khaufun alaihim wa laa hum yahzanoon.’
‘Whether they are the ones who believe, or whether they are Jews, Christians or Saabieen, all who believe in Allah and the last day, and do righteous deeds, their reward is surely secure with their Lord; they need have no fear, nor shall they grieve.’
—Al Qur’an Al Kareem: 2 Al Baqarah: 62
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p18#c438
AAAA wrote ridiculously copying me from somewhere else:
‘BTW we don’t need you certification, first you ask yourself what you are doing, you are living you life in confused state, one end you are saying you don’t believe in idol worshim at one end you are saying you believe in one god and messenger, don’t be hypocrites or else you are trying to please any muslims in this forum.
first decide yourself, islam & muslim don’t need your or anybody certificate. their is no contradiction in quran and hadith and the one who follows it strictly with stong believe are muslims. to please somebody if you are doing that and living in a confused state means thats is your problem or you are doing in wantedly, i judge a person in the light of quran and hadith & in that their is a explanation of all kind people.
Masaalama Yakhi’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p18#c434
I replied:
‘You have ridiculously written, imitating me, absolutely out of context:
‘BTW we don’t need you certification.’
I am not issuing any certificate.
You are issuing it for Sidrah, me and my wife, Saiyada Fatima PhD, in Arabic Islamic literature.
The more we are trying to avoid the unpleasant discussion, the more you are insisting to issue the certificate.
We don’t need it.
We know your type of people very well.
You created Sunni, Shia, Ahmadi, Wahabi and so on firqas expelling them out of Islam, as if Islam is your father’s property.
The people, like you, forced Akbar to abandon Islam at last and devise an altogether new religion Dine Ilahi that was the religion of state from thereon.
I don’t expect you to realize your fatal mistakes even now.
You are so convinced that the interpretations of Muslim Badshahs are only the real Islam that you are not paying any attention to the Qur’anic verses I am quoting again and again.
You are not telling, in the presence of these Aayate Kareemat, why you are right and why I am wrong.
You just avoid them and go on repeating your baseless silly accusations repetitively:
‘And when they are told:’Follow what Allah has revealed’, they say:’No, we shall follow what we found our forefathers practicing.’
What! Even if their forefathers lacked understanding, and right guidance?
Those who have refused to follow the way of Allah resemble cattle; when the shepherd calls them they hear nothing except shouting and crying.
They are deaf, dumb, and blind, and so they understand nothing.’
—Al Qur’an Al Kareem: 2 Al Baqarah: 170 171‘
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p18#c439
AAAA told:
‘who is akber what is dine illahi, it is people like you and theis is one writer from india Arun shourie who always quote the things out of the context and malign islam. you can check all my post, we are arabs and we believe in only Allah and the messanger thats it. don’t try to spread fake things , you are hypocrites at one end you are hindu and the other end you are saying you believe in Allah, that’s what is said in Sahih Bukhari about the Hypocrites.”they say they are one of you when they are with you, when they are behind they will refuse it”.
i have quote everything with Ref, ok.
can you or your PHD wife Read what surah baqrah says in Versus 221. and explain it if you are not hypocrites.
And whoever contradicts and opposes the Messenger (Muhammad, Peace Be
Upon Him) after the right path has been shown clearly to him, and
follows other than the believers'(Ummah/Sahaba) ways. We shall keep
him in the path he has chosen, and burn him in Hell – what an evil
destination.(Surah An-Nisaa 4:115)
who is badshah and akbar may be they are your ideal.
our muslims Role model is Only Muhammed SAW got it.
you country people now akber, badshah and all that stupied people .
we now Khaled bin waleed, have you ever heard of him or you PHD wife? all the companians?
i now your country specially of politics .
anyways MAKE UP YOUR MIND , don’t live in confused state.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p18#c440
I replied:
‘Sorry! So, I have touched your paining nerve?
I expected so.
I wanted to bring your real identity on Internet.
I am glad I’ve succeeded.
Returning to your old ethnic pride?
That’s what you Arab people did, after martyrdom of Hazrat Ali(A).
All your old Arab ethnicity awakened and in the new disguise of Islam, you started to quarrel with each other resuming your own old dirty ethnic qabaili quarrels Islam had succeeded in postponing at last.
Under the great Khilafat of Hazrat Abu Bakr Siddiq(R), Hazrat Umar(R), Hazrat Usman Ghani(R) and Hazrat Ali(A), you people had learned profoundly that your old dirty Arab ethnicity which was termed Jahiliyat, Ignorance, can never flourish up if the real Islam will remain in power. So you people, I mean people like you in then Arab, conspired and started to quarrel with each other, keeping aside the great Islamic brotherhood, as you are ignoring all the Aayaate Kareemat I am quoting.
The conspiracy brought, ultimately, Hazrat Myavia(A) into power ostensibly and Mal’oon Yazeed actually.
It resulted into Karbala.
Don’t throw stones on our Indian history.
Your Arabian history is also not very good.
You are priding on Huzoor(S) today while the separatists Arabs like you caused Karbala, knowingly or unknowingly, it does not make any difference.
You have with all your non Islamic dirty ethnic pride have written:
‘who is akber what is dine illahi, it is people like you.’
Yes! Akbar was a people like us.
It is a great pride for me and my wife, Saiyada Fatima PhD in Arabic Islamic literature; that the people like you are comparing us with the great personality of Akbar the great.
As for Sidrah, she can speak for herself.
I have no right to speak for her.
She can respond on it herself.
But as for my wife and me are concerned, it is a great honor for us, that we are being compared with the great Mughal, Mughale Aazm Shahanshah Jalaluddin Muhammad Akbar.
Thank you very much.
We are grateful to you.
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p18#c441
You have continued to write:
‘theis is one writer from india Arun shourie who always quote the things out of the context and malign islam.
It is now you who is bringing the matter out of context in discussion.
I am not going to respond it positively or otherwise.
I’m not responsible for what others of my countrypeople do.
Arun Shourie is a great writer and is fully competent to defend himself.
He does not need me to advocate him.
You have written:
‘you can check all my post, we are arabs and we believe in only Allah and the messanger thats it.’
I don’t need to.
I believe you if you say so, because it is sufficient for me to accept a person’s validity of Eiman, if one declares so.
I never go to the extent to call him hypocrite.
I, and my wife joins me in this attitude; leave these great services of Islam to the people like you.
We don’t qualify such great services.
It suits to you high ethnic Arab people.
Keep it on and separate all the persons from each other who claim to be Muslims on this pretext or another.
You are doing a great service.
Even Huzoor(S) could not do it.
There were no Shia or Sunni as long as he(S) was present on the Earth.
You have written further:
don’t try to spread fake things , you are hypocrites at one end you are hindu and the other end you are saying you believe in Allah, that’s what is said in Sahih Bukhari about the Hypocrites.”they say they are one of you when they are with you, when they are behind they will refuse it”.
How do you know what we do behind?
Are you omniscient?
We have read in Qur’ane Azeem that only Allah is omniscient.
I did not know you Arabs also share Him in this privilege!
Great!
What an Eiman!
You further write:
‘i have quote everything with Ref, ok.
can you or your PHD wife Read what surah baqrah says in Versus 221. and explain it if you are not hypocrites.’
As if you care what we explain.
Everyone can see who is hypocrite!
You have quoted:
And whoever contradicts and opposes the Messenger (Muhammad, Peace Be
Upon Him) after the right path has been shown clearly to him, and
follows other than the believers'(Ummah/Sahaba) ways. We shall keep
him in the path he has chosen, and burn him in Hell – what an evil
destination.(Surah An-Nisaa 4:115)
I have already replied it.
Let me copy paste what I had written:
”I am neither contradicting nor opposing Huzoor(S).
‘The Jews say that the Christians have nothing and the Christians say that the Jews have nothing of it, though both read the Scripture. And those who have no knowledge of the Scripture also make similar claims. Allah will surely give His judgment on the Day of Resurrection in all the matters in which they differ.’
—Al Qur’an Al Kareem: 2 Al Baqarah: 113
‘The fact is that no one has any special claim to Paradise; whoever surrenders himself to Allah in obedience and follows the Right Way, shall get his reward from his Lord: there shall be neither fear nor grief for such people.’
—Al Qur’an Al Kareem: 2 Al Baqarah: 112
‘wala taAAthaw fee al-ardi mufsideena’
Do not spread disorder on earth.
—Al Qur’an Al Majeed 2 Al Baqarah: 60.
‘Whenever it is said to them, “Spread not disorder on the earth”, their reply is, “We only seek to put things aright”.
—Al Qur’an Al Kareem: 2 Al Baqarah: 11
‘Beware! They do spread disorder but they realize it not.’
—Al Qur’an Al Kareem: 2 Al Baqarah: 12
I believe Allah knows better what is Islam than you.
Sorry to differ with you altogether in the matter.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p19#c442
‘The last part of what you have written is:
‘who is badshah and akbar may be they are your ideal.
our muslims Role model is Only Muhammed SAW got it.
you country people now akber, badshah and all that stupied people .’
‘Great! Akbar was stupid for this proudy stupid Arab.
Is he really Muslim?
Vallah aalam Vissawab!
His manners indicate otherwise!
You continued to write:
we now Khaled bin waleed, have you ever heard of him or you PHD wife? all the companians?’
See this foolish person!
He is asking whether a PhD in Arabic Islamic literature and her husband, even Hindu, have heard about Hazrat Khalid bin Valeed(R).
What an understanding!
‘i now your country specially of politics .’
How specialized knowledge you have!
Nobody, except you great Arab people, has succeeded to know this greatest secret!
‘anyways MAKE UP YOUR MIND , don’t live in confused state.’
The foolish person is himself/herself, I don’t know which, he/she is afraid of using his/her real name, confused and imposing his/her confusion on us.
Huzoor! Sarkar! Arab the great! My mind is already made up!My mind is already made up!My mind is already made up!
You have finished with:
‘don’t live in confused state.’
I am absolutely clear in my mind!I am absolutely clear in my mind!I am absolutely clear in my mind!
Thanks for the concern shown!
Hamare bhi hain meharban kaise kaise!’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p19#c443
I said:
‘What did you expect from me when you called all my country people Stupid people?
‘you country people now akber, badshah and all that stupied people .’
Did you expect I will be glad that you have called all my country people Stupid and will announce that ‘I love you for your great love for me and my country people?
You used first this word ‘Stupid’ and now you yourself are complaining for it?
What an attitude!
Great manners!
My country people were not talking to you.
What was the context to call all my country people Stupid?
If one abuses one one should be prepared to be abused.
Instead, the entire Internet Community can appreciate my civilized reaction that I have called Stupid only you, not all your country people.
They can’t be held responsible for your attitude.
Nevertheless, I did not mean it.
It was only to show you and make you realize that you should not have done it.
I’m sorry! I don’t think you are really stupid. It were bad manners in response to your bad manners!
I am profoundly sorry that I have to resort to that attitude.
You did not leave another option for me.
Sorry again nevertheless!
Now, why have you written that long passage?
You have not clarified it.
If you think I advocate all those inhuman activities of the so called Hindus, you are quite wrong. I don’t.
However, I don’t know the full details.
As such, I am not a suitable person to comment on it.
If the incidences happened as you described it is inhumane and barbaric, but my experience is that the media is generally anti Hindu in the matters.
I’m giving two links here.
If you like to go on the matter, you may click the links and can understand what I mean by it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Hinduism
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Brahminism
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p19#c455
Salman wrote:
<quoted text>
We should not adopt hypocrisy and should give simple answers.
We Muslims believe what Hazrat Muhammad (SAW) did was right hence I as a Muslim will act like our Prophet (SAW) did. My question was not that how you differ with Hazrat Muhammad (SAW) instead it was can u do the same what Prophet (SAW) did?
It’s a simple Yes or No my friend!’
I said:
‘No! It is not a simple case of yes and no!
And if you still think it a simple case of yes and no, you have not understood what why and when Huzoor(S) did what he(S) did.
He(S) did not do it until he had won Mecca and thereby physically had changed the law of the land.
He respected the law of the land more than you so called Muslims do.
He never imposed his version of Islam on others.
He was a great personality and you are not following even his(S) shadow.
You think you follow him(S).
‘think’, not ‘follow’ really.
Until and unless he(S) did not succeed in changing the law of the land, what did he do?
He(S) followed the law of the land.
He(S) did not only differ with the law of the land, he(S) hated it immensely.
Yet, he(S) respected it to the extent that when a Muslim was captured by the then Mushrikeene Arab, and succeeded in running away from them, in spite of the fact that none of the Muslims agreed with him(S), he(S) returned the Muslim to the Mushrikeene Arab.
It was the respect of the law of the land, till it was the law of the land.
And, as soon as he(S) was capable to change it, he(S) changed it with a blow and then, THEN, he(S) crushed the idols.
So, Janab Salman Sahab! it was the seerat Sarvare Aalam(S)which won the then rotten globe.
What do you think, India was not benefited by him(S) then?
You are quite mistaken again.
According to Bhavishy’Puran, the Great Poet of Sanskr’t Mahakavi Kalidas went to Huzoor(S) and according to the same Puran, he embraced Islam.
Huzoor(S) wanted Hazrat Zainab bint Jahash(R) should not divorce his(S) slave Hazrat Zaid bin Haris, she(R) refused to agree with him(S).
What did he(S) do?
Declared her(R) out of Islam?
Said she(R) were not a Muslimah anymore, as she refused to obey him(S)?
No! He(S) allowed her(S) what she wanted to do and married her(R) himself, even against all the criticism till now!
He did not impose his(S) version of Islam on anyone.
He preached Islam, not his(S) version of Islam.
You people claim to follow that great personalty(S).
Understand him(S) before you claim.
No! I also respect the law of the land as Huzoor(S) did.
Therefore I will never crush idols till it is prohibited in the law of the land.
Thanks for bearing with me so far!’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p19#c456
I said further:
‘No! I am not confused at all.
The difference of opinion arises because we don’t mean the same thing when we use the words already very much in use.
I believe the religion is what our divine books preach, not that we believe and practice.
When I use the word Hinduism I always mean what the Ved preaches, irrespective of what the so called Hindus believe, practice, or preach.
Their wishes are not Hinduism.
It is not my self devised definition of Hinduism.
Ved claims:
‘svayambhooryathatathyatoartha nvyadadhachchhashvateebhyah samabhyah’
‘The Self Existent has constituted the values for eternal subjects forever according to facts.’
Manusmr’ti supports it:
‘Vedo’khilo dharmmoolam’
‘The entire Ved is the root of Dharm.’
‘Dharmjigyasmananam pramanam paramam Shrutih’.
‘For the persons who want to know what the Dharm is, Ved is the absolute criteria.’
You don’t believe it.
You believe Hinduism is what you find in the practices of the so called Hindus.
It is the fundamental difference of opinion we two have between us.
Till we have this fundamental difference, there will always be this or that differences between our discussions.
We will never agree with each other.
Similarly, I believe Islam is what Qur’ano ahadeese muqaddasat tell us, not what Muslims believe, do and practice.
You differ with me here also.
You believe Islam is what interpreted by the Muslim Badshahs or for them also.
I differ with you strongly and fundamentally.
It brings all the other differences between us about Islam and Muslims.
The difference of opinion will always be there as we differ in our fundamental definitions.
Sorry! but it is the actual truth.
Sorry to differ with you so profoundly.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p17#c418@@@
Salman said:
‘Durgesh!
My friend I just want to say that I m no one to judge any one’s Iman it is a matter which must be decided by Allah. But what I have under stood after talking to you that you believe on one God but you said that you are a Hindu at the same time; but there are some other believes in Islam which differs from Hinduism so how can you say that both the religions are same?
For example Hazrat Muhammad (SAW) crushed the idols after the conquest of Macca so being a Hindu can you do this?(Again I would say don’t get me wrong and I m not giving any Muslim king example I m giving the example of Prophet Muhammad (SAW)).’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p17#c416
I said:
‘Again the same objection that I have already answered.
When I say I am a Hindu, I do not mean that I am an Idol worshiper.
I hate idol worship.
According to Ved Eishan Param Brahm Paramatma, i.e. the God, has no idol at all.
You find an image of idol worshiper as soon as you hear the word Hindu.
That is the trouble between us.
We don’t mean same thing by the word Hindu.
The definition of Hindu is not my self devised definition.
It is written in Sanskr’t dictionaries.
Shabd Kalpdrum/Raamkosh states:
‘Hindurdushtnr’h prokto’naary’neetividooshakah
Saddharmpaalako Vidvan Shrautdharmparaayanah.’
‘A Hindu is the one who never compromise with a wicked. He abolishes the wicked policies. He practices the religion of existence. He is full of wisdom. He is efficient in Dharm as preached in Ved.’
The other definitions of Hindu also follow this dictionary meaning:
‘Hinsaya dooyate chittam yasy’ tadapi hinasti dushtan yah s’ Hindurityabhidheeyate.’
‘One whose conscience does not feel at ease at violence, but nevertheless he kills a wicked is called a Hindu.’
You do not accept these authentic definitions of a Hindu and I am adamant that these are the only authentic definitions of a Hindu.
I am Hindu according to these authentic definitions.
Whenever I claim to be Hindu I always refer to these authentic definitions, not to an idolater.
You can see yourself there is nothing to associate idolatry with Hinduism in these definitions.
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p17#c419
AAAA wrote:
<quoted text>
brother salman,
Can you ask your friend to quote a single verse or give any referance about the story he is telling about Rasool??
in the whole world the enemy of islam are manupulating and modifying the authentic islam shariah??
where did he read about this? is their any evidence??’
I replied:
‘So the hypocrite, calling hypocrite others, has not even read Seerat Sarvare Aalam(S) profoundly.
Yet, he claims that he follows him(S)!
Great! He follows the personality(S) he does not even know profoundly. And he declares others out of Islam!
Carry on!
You are exposing yourself in front of the entire Internet Community as more you are commenting on me.
Janab Salman Sahab! Have you also not studied Seerat Sarvare Aalam so profoundly?
I sympathize with all you people!
Learn what the real Islam is, before preaching it to others!’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
I continued further:
‘Everybody has his own version of the ideology he practices.
You have not thought of it?
Well, think now!
Why did Hazrat Abu Bakr Siddiq(R) nominate Hazrat Umar(R) his janasheen Khaleefa while Huzoor(S) did not do it?
Why did the entire Muslim Community then, not opposed him(R) that he(R) is not following (?) Huzoor(S)?
Tell MR.AAAA to answer it.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p20#c463
AAAA wrote:
‘brother salman,
Can you ask your friend to quote a single verse or give any referance about the story he is telling about Rasool??
in the whole world the enemy of islam are manupulating and modifying the authentic islam shariah??
where did he read about this? is their any evidence??’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p19#c458
Naturally, I smiled at it:
‘Well, the entire Internet Community must observe and notice that the hypocrite does not know even what Huzoor(s) did, when and why.
Instead of studying Seerat Sarvare Aalam(S) profoundly, he is preaching others what the Islam is and declaring others to be out of Islam.
Great!
‘Whenever it is said to them, “Spread not disorder on the earth”, their reply is, “We only seek to put things aright”.
—Al Qur’ān Al Kareem: 2 Al Baqarah: 11
‘Beware! They do spread disorder but they realize it not.’
—Al Qur’ān Al Kareem: 2 Al Baqarah: 12‘
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p20#c464
Disparately AAAA wrote:
‘what is seerat savare Alaam, can you explain, we took our islamic teaching in Madinah munawarah university , we haven’t heard of this teaching or no Mutawaah nows about this, what is this??
and the 3 versus of surah Baqarah is surely implemented for you people.
(49. 15 )
: Only those are Believers who have believed in Allah and His Messenger, and have never since doubted, but have striven with their belongings and their persons in the Cause of Allah: Such are the sincere ones.
(49.17 )
: They impress on thee as a favour that they have embraced Islam. Say, “Count not your Islam as a favour upon me: Nay, Allah has conferred a favour upon you that He has guided you to the faith, if ye be true and sincere.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p20#c465
I smiled again:
‘Still trying to save your face? You think all I reiterated never happened in the history?
Well, go through all the authentic versions of Seerat Sarvare Aalam.
All the authentic complete books on Seerat(S) contain it.
Study the great life of the Muhsine Insaniyat(S).
I promise you you will really enjoy it and it will enhance your Eiman, moreover.
Learn what the real Islam is yourself.
Don’t hear it from others.
Learn yourself.
Allah hafiz, mr.AAAA! you did not tell me your real name after all.
What is there to hide it?
Anyway, Allah hafiz!’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p20#c466
Panicked AAAA said frantically:
‘i don’t want to spoil my Iman by reading which was not taught to us from Allah & rasool.
we obey Allah & his messanger , QURAN & Hadith. thats it , the other books are for the people whose iman is not strong or for the munafikh.
as i told earlier by asking my name you want to run away from the topic, i m not interested in nowing real name too.
spread this fake knowledge of islam to those name sake muslims of your country whose iman is weak.
what is that seerat, sawareay and i don’t now what else, hahah
below ayat was released for people like you
CH:2 V:11
“WHEN WE SAYS TO THEM DON’T PLAY MISCHEIF ON EARTH, THEY SAY THEY ARE PEACE MAKERS”.
2 : 13
” When it is said to them: “Believe as the others believe:” They say: “Shall we believe as the fools believe?” Nay, of a surety they are the fools, but they do not know.
Masalaama Yakhi’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p20#c467
I laughed at him:
‘Look at him.
His Eiman is in danger if he reads Seerat Sarvare Aalam(S).
Great!
You are the unique person.
Repeating the Aayate Kareemat I quoted?
Well, children learn gradually.
Keep on to Watch my comments. You will learn more.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p20#c468
Salman briefed the idiot AAAA:
‘AAAA,
Hazrat Zainab bint Jahsh(R) was a Muslim lady of the Qur’aish aristocracy and the Prophet’s cousin. On his request, she agreed to marry his freed slave and adopted son, Zaid Bin Haris(R). However the marriage was not successful, and ended in divorce. The Prophet, peace be upon him, subsequently married Zainab.
Durgesh,
The Matter between Hazrat Zainab bint Jahsh(R) and Zaid Bin Haris(R) was their internal matter there was no question of belief or disbelief by the way she didn’t marry a non-Muslim and Hazrat Muhammad (SAW) never gave punishment to any one on lawful personal matters. Islam permits a woman to marry with her own wish but not to a non-Muslim.
Don’t forget that Hazrat Muhammad (SAW) on many occasions had said that nobody is exempt from the rule of Islam even his dear daughter Fatima(R). For instance, when a woman named Fatima was brought to him with the charges of stealing. The holy prophet ordered to cut her hand. She prayed for mercy and forgiveness for her crime. He said that even if his daughter were there, he would have ordered the same because there’s no exemption in the rules of Islam.
Yes, Hazrat Abu Bakr Siddiq(R) nominated Hazrat Umar(R) his janasheen or Khaleefa so what is the point? There was no alteration in the religion if he had nominated Hazrat Umar(R).’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p20#c471
I said:
‘Salman! your real name ashamed friend AAAA is causing your intelligence also to diminish.
You were brilliant till now, but see how his foolish aura is affecting you now:
You write:
‘The Matter between Hazrat Zainab bint Jahsh(R) and Zaid Bin Haris(R) was their internal matter.’
Who said it was not? who said it was an external matter?
I have written:
‘Huzoor(S) wanted Hazrat Zainab bint Jahash(R) should not divorce his(S) slave Hazrat Zaid bin Haris, she(R) refused to agree with him(S).
What did he(S) do?
Declared her(R) out of Islam?
Said she(R) were not a Muslima anymore as she(R) refused to obey him(S)?
No! He(S) allowed her(S) what she wanted to do and married her(R) himself, even against all the criticism till now!
He did not impose his(S) version of Islam on anyone.
He preached Islam, not his(S) version of Islam.
You people claim to follow that great personalty(S).
Understand him(S) before you claim.’
It is clear from the excerpt itself that it was referred to explain why you people’s attitude differs with the attitude of Huzoor(S) so profoundly.
You are adamantly forcing your personal views and the views of outdated Muslim Badshahs in the name of Islam and insisting that if they are not accepted the person you are talking with is not a Muslim.
I gave an example that Huzoor(S) allowed even to differ with him(S).
He did not announce the persons are out of Islam.
In this context, there was no question of my marriage with a Saiyad Muslim girl, Saiyada Fatima PhD.
That question is separately answered by the answer of your question about what I would do with the idols.
I have answered that I would crush them if the law of the land permits me to do it.
With this final answer it is proved that I’m not a Non Muslim as you people are barking ab initio.
Yet, you go on again to question the validity of our marriage.
Again starting from ABCD.
This great quality of never reading the answer, and going again and again repeating your question; was not in you, before.
Your friend AAAA had this great, full of wisdom, quality right from the beginning.
Now you are also developing it.
Great!
He is not improving. You are going down.
What a progress!
The question of nomination for Khilafat was also raised to prove the point that Huzoor(S) were more democrat than even Hazrat Abu Bakr Siddiq(R).
You missed it.
You never missed my point before .
It is the first time.
While your friend AAAA is so full of prejudices against me that he never got my any point.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p20#c472
Salman wrote:
‘Durgesh!
I didn’t miss your point. May be I failed to convey my message, anyways the point which I was trying to convey is Yes, Hazrat Muhammad (SAW) didn’t announce that the people who don’t obey him are out of Islam but there are different type of matters for example if someone say something wrong about Hazrat Muhammad (SAW) he is out of Islam or if a Muslim woman marry a non-believer than the marriage is null and void (and I was not targeting you specifically it was an example)where as if someone steals something than you cannot say that he/she is out of Islam although it is a wrong act. The example of Hazrat Fatima (R) which I gave was because even Hazrat Muhammad (SAW) was bound to obey the Islamic law b/c it is the law of Allah.
I had seen your answer about idols. If you are a Muslim than I think you should declare it openly and if you can’t because of family and society and you are a Muslim who believes on only Allah than I m sorry for considering you a Hindu.’
He wrote further:
‘Again I am sorry if u are a Muslim and I hurt your feelings but this doesn’t mean than I am against Hindus that’s why after I m saying this after knowing that u r a Muslim no Muslim (including AAAA) is against Hinduism.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p20#c474
I said:
‘Salman! I believe you. But your friend AAAA is a cheater. He/she defends vulgarism, acts judge and expels the persons out of Islam while he does not have any deep knowledge of Islam himself. His bluff must be called off. His attitude is dangerous to the society. Sorry! if you don’t agree with me.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p20#c477
Salman said:
‘But Durgesh we need to figure out this issue .I have said that if you are a Muslim or if you were a Hindu and then you accepted Islam after that you married your wife its great. but what about a Muslim girl who is married to a Hindu guy? Their status of marriage is null and void according to Quran. isn’t it?’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p20#c478
AAAA said:
‘Brother Salman,
i can tell you the stories of many prophets here like people of Aad & samud during Saleh alaisalaam,Nuh alai salaam etc. but what i m trying to say is we have to follow shahada,
after reciting the shahada just believe in Allah and messenger thats it, A Role model for all the muslims should be only Muhammed SAW.
Allah Almighty warns the Muslims:
“O you who believe, if a wicked evildoer comes to you with a news
report, look carefully into it to verify the truth, lest you harm a
people in ignorance and afterwards feel remorseful for what you have
done.”
(Quran, 49:6)’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p20#c479
Salman replied AAAA:
‘AAAA,
I agree with you but we should answer Durgesh if he has some questions in his mind. There was a misunderstanding and I even thought that he is a Hindu but he has accepted that he is a Muslim and maybe he have some family or society problems that’s why he can’t declare openly that he is a Muslim.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p20#c480
AAAA said:
‘Durgesh jabalpur wrote:
<quoted text>
Well, I invite all the so called Muslims who think they know and practice Islam better, to reply him.
As for me, I don’t think Islam also does preach violence.
It preaches violence only if there is no other way to remove inhumanity.
Well, Lord Bhagvan Ram, The Maryada Purushottam even, had to surrender to violence against Raxasas and their king Ravan.
Lord Bhagvan Kr’shn, also had to do the same against Kans, Duryodhan, Jarasandh, etc.
The only difference is they did not have any barbarism of Pre Islamic Arabs, as Islam had to face.
In Karbala, Yazeed Mal’oon revived that old Pre Islamic Arab barbarism.
All the later Muslim kings used it with the name of Islam.
Huzoor(S) lost his daughter’s son in Karbala.
So, he(S) was also a prey of this so called Jihad!
It was not Jihad.
It was a dirty political warfare and Islam is not responsible for it.
That, my friends! is my view.
You may discuss it, but I have a long history and Qur’ano Ahadeese Muqaddasat to support my view.’
AAAA argued desparately:
‘Can you quote us the Referance for any of the above? if its related to Islam as you are mention Islam , Islam again & again?
the below even though you understand you wont go with it i know but still, as i told earlier….
Don’t judge a car by its driver:
If you want to judge how good is the latest model of the “Mercedes” car and a person who does not know how to drive sits at the steering wheel and bangs up the car, who will you blame? The car or the driver? But naturally, the driver. To analyze how good the car is, a person should not look at the driver but see the ability and features of the car. How fast is it, what is its average fuel consumption, what are the safety measures, etc. Even if I agree for the sake of argument that the Muslims are bad, we can’t judge Islam by its followers? If you want to judge how good Islam is then judge it according to its authentic sources, i.e. the Glorious Qur’an and the Sahih Hadith.
. Judge Islam by its best follower i.e. Prophet Mohammed (pbuh):
If you practically want to check how good a car is put an expert driver behind the steering wheel. Similarly the best and the most exemplary follower of Islam by whom you can check how good Islam is, is the last and final messenger of God, Prophet Muhammad (pbuh). Besides Muslims, there are several honest and unbiased non-Muslim historians who have acclaimed that prophet Muhammad was the best human being. According to Michael H. Hart who wrote the book,‘The Hundred Most Influential Men in History’, the topmost position, i.e. the number one position goes to the beloved prophet of Islam, Muhammad (pbuh). There are several such examples of non-Muslims paying great tributes to the prophet, like Thomas Carlyle, La-Martine, etc
” Only those are Believers who have believed in Allah and His Messenger, and have never since doubted, but have striven with their belongings and their persons in the Cause of Allah: Such are the sincere ones”.
QURAN (49. 15 )’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p22#c508
My response:
‘Well, look at her.
She/he is unable to understand what I wrote.
What did you understand the great believer in Islam! that you want the proof of?
Whether there was no Karbala?
Was Yazeed Mal’oon not its villain?
Was Yazeed not supported by his father Hazrat Myavia(R)?
Did Hazrat Myavia(R) not claim he(R) were right?
Was he(R)not responsible for the end of Khilafate Rashida thus?
Were Hazrat Myavia(R) also a real khaleefa as Hazrat Abu Bakr Siddiq(R) were? as Hazrat Umar (R) were? as Hazrat Usman ghani (R) were? as Hazrat Ali (R) were?
If not, for what are you asking proof?
As you claim, you are the only true Muslim left in the world now.
All the others are Munafiqeen or liable to be expelled from Islam.
Answer him gravely.
Let’s see what the Efficient Ms/Mr AAAA has to say.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p22#c509
Salman tried to mediate:
‘The problem is people often relate freedom struggles and terrorism(they both are different things) with Islam. If you people can see that how Palestine,Kashmir,Iraq are under occupation and people used to relate their struggle with violence.
People often choose that part of the religion which suits them. Extremes on either side are harmful if we say that Yazeed was right it is false and if we say that Mughal emperor Akbar was right than it is also wrong.
We can take the example of Muhammad Bin Qasim who was forced to attach sindh but later on he proved that he was a good ruler.
About Hazrat Amir Muawiya(R) supporting Yazeed is a disputed issue and different schools of thoughts of Islam have their own view on this.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p22#c512
Further:
‘Durgesh,
I condemn the nick of that guy against India but some other Indians use vulgur language against Pakistan we should condemn them all.
Similarly as you cannot hear something against India we can’t hear any thing against Pakistan.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p22#c513
I said:
‘if we say that Yazeed was right it is false and if we say that Mughal emperor Akbar was right than it is also wrong.’
So you compare Yazeed Mal’oon with Akbar?
What are the similarities,you have found, in both of them?
Yazeed Mal’oon was a blood hound.
Akbar was a person of peace.
Yazeed destroyed the great humanistic movement of Islam, continued so far by the great martyr Kaleefas Hazrat Abu Bakr Siddiq(R), Hazrat Umar (R), Hazrat Usman ghani (R), and Hazrat Ali (R).
He is the villain of entire humanity.
The entire humankind must condemn Yazeed Mal’oon forever.
It was Yazeed Mal’oon who destroyed the dreams of Huzoor(S).
He revived the old Arab barbarism in the disguise of Islam.
It was the first political misuse of the name of Islam.
The later Muslim kings misutilized it again and again for their own vested dirty political interests.
Yazeed Mal’oon provided them the role model.
The case of Akbar is exactly opposite.
He hated the violence in the so called Islam.
He tried to stop Bairam Khan to kill Hemu or Hemchandr Vikramadity’ as his full name was.
Bairam Khan did not stop and killed Hemu or Hemchandr Vikramadity‘ in the name of Islam.
Akbar was shocked.
He could not imagine why it was necessary.
In his ignorance, he started to hate Islam, while he should have hated the so called Muslims of the time who were blood hounds.
None told Bairam Khan how Muhsine Insaniyat(S) forgave his(S) and even Islam’s worst enemies so far when Makka was won.
It is not highlighted ever as it does not suit the vile purposes of the transgressors.
Huzoor(S) are painted in front of non Muslims as if he(S) were also (Nauzbillah!) a blood hound like them.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p22#c515
Further:
‘I understand. And I respect your patriotism.
I condemn all the vulgarities.
However, I expect Muslims to behave more responsibly:
‘Do not revile those whom they invoke other than Allah, because they will revile Allah in ignorance out of spite.’
—Al Qur’an Al Majeed: 6 Al An’am 108.
Will the Muslims be forgiven, for not obeying Al Qur’an Al Majeed, on the ground that the non Muslims did not obey it?
The forum is being watched internationally.
What is the character of a Muslim it depicting?
Should Muslims don’t watch themselves?
They are representative of Islam.
Should they not act more responsibly?
May Allah Rabbil Aalmeen bless all of us.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p22#c516
AAAA tried to defend himself in vain:
‘this is MR AAAA , what her or she you are using.
just you tell me one thing , what is that you are trying to proof? you believe in ALlah but you are not a muslim?
what is that you are trying to proof? this doesn’t say your are confused guy?
: Only those are Believers who have believed in Allah and His Messenger, and have never since doubted, but have striven with their belongings and their persons in the Cause of Allah: Such are the sincere ones.
QURAN (49. 15 )
QURAN : 5: 36
” As to those who reject Faith,- if they had everything on earth, and twice repeated, to give as ransom for the penalty of the Day of Judgment, it would never be accepted of them, theirs would be a grievous penalty:.
QURAN : 5: 3
”Their wish will be to get out of the Fire, but never will they get out therefrom: their penalty will be one that endures”.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
Further:
‘Tell me one thing , which is the first month according to Islam ? what does Youmal Aashur means??
as you talk about karbala and all a lot??
CH:2 V:11
“WHEN WE SAYS TO THEM DON’T PLAY MISCHEIF ON EARTH, THEY SAY THEY ARE PEACE MAKERS”.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p22#c518
I said:
‘Answer me first. You can’t just bark anything and run away.
First, answer me and then I’ll answer your new questions.
I repeat my questions for your ready reference:
‘Well, look at her.
She/he is unable to understand what I wrote.
What did you understand the great believer in Islam! that you want the proof of?
Whether there was no Karbala?
Was Yazeed Mal’oon not its villain?
Was Yazeed not supported by his father Hazrat Myavia(R)?
Did Hazrat Myavia(R) not claim he(R) were right?
Was he(R)not responsible for the end of Khilafate Rashida thus?
Were Hazrat Myavia(R) also a real khaleefa as Hazrat Abu Bakr Siddiq(R) were? as Hazrat Umar (R) were? as Hazrat Usman ghani (R) were? as Hazrat Ali (R) were?
If not, for what are you asking proof?
As you claim, you are the only true Muslim left in the world now.
All the others are Munafiqeen or liable to be expelled from Islam.
Answer him gravely.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p22#c519
AAAA said:
‘you may be having knowledge about the kings , why do you want to twist things with others.
their are only 4 companians and muslims ROLE MODEL should be only Muhammed SAW thats it.
if you want i can tell you the stories like the Flow chart about all the Ibn ADAM. we are not interested in it,
bottom line believe in Allah and his messenger .
don’t make things complicated and create misconception about islam.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p22#c520
I said:
‘You are the greatest enemy of Islam and the people alike.
You don’t go to the principles. You go to history and call it Islam.
Don’t tell me what Islam is. I know more than you and I have already proved it in this very Forum.
I can understand you.
You are afraid of me.
You want to keep me out and the people alike of discussing Islam.
It brings all the munafiqeen like you in broad daylight.
I am not afraid of you.
I am not shy of my real name even like you are.
So ashamed of your real name you are that you keep it secret still now.
Why?
Are your name involved with activities dangerous to the humanity as a whole?
Is is famous for gay activities?
What is there you are so ashamed of?
You have shamelessly followed your tradition:
‘why do you want to twist things with others.’
I challenge you.
Prove what I have twisted.
The entire sophisticated Internet Society has watched you and me both.
Everything is written and recorded.
Prove me wrong in anything I have written.
It’s an open challenge to you.
I’m calling your bluff openly.
Meet it.
Go through all my 606 comments and prove me wrong if I have written something injurious to humanity.
You munafiq!
You can’t do it.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p22#c521
the things made Fard(obligatory) people take it easy on stupied things spend their life.
& over all why you are interested in it, when you are not a muslim, not want to be muslims???
REFERENCE IS VERY IMPORTANT , specially in this generation, because enemy of islams are every were & we don’t trust the words which are coming out of their mouth.
masalaama
AAAA desparately tried to save his face:
‘you know islam more then me that is the reason you are HINDU-Disbeliever i think??how diplomatic,
you follow that king what was his name some AKBER , better you follow him.
the name itself is a shirk, muhammed akber, Unawzibillah. good this is what you understand about islam, always talking about history of this sort of people and xpressing you know Islam.
very good knowledge about islam you have????’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p22#c522
I challenged the hypocrite:
‘Again running away?
What about my challenge?
Prove in my 610 comments anything injurious to humanity.
Also prove in all those 610 comments anything against Qur’ano ahadeese muqaddasat.
One more thing!
Prove in all those 610 comments of mine anything against Ved.
You can’t prove it.
So, I have everything there according to Ved, according to Qur’ano ahadeese muqaddasat, according to humanity.
Prove otherwise.
What more a person need for a happy life?’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p22#c523
AAAA said:
‘enjoying and getting pleased by the opposite sex even though its against the religion fundamental against the creator then also you go with it.
Hello.. sorry you are conversing with wrong guy.
creator the almigty is more important to us .
that doesn’t mean we are not taking about humanity , islam means peace but don’t create misconception about islam just to impress or pleased humans , i hope you understand .
thats all you cannot understand it as for that you have to be beleiver first,
QURAN (49. 15 )
: Only those are Believers who have believed in Allah and His Messenger, and have never since doubted, but have striven with their belongings and their persons in the Cause of Allah: Such are the sincere ones.
In yansurkumu Allahu fala ghaliba lakum wa-in yakhthulkum faman tha allathee yansurukum min baAAdihi waAAala Allahi falyatawakkali almu/minoona
If Allah helps you, none can overcome you: If He forsakes you, who is there, after that, that can help you? in Allah, then, Let believers put their trust.
Surah Imran :(3:160)’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p22#c524
I admitted:
‘Now, at last, we are getting somewhere with this queer person!
He/She writes:
‘enjoying and getting pleased by the opposite sex even though its against the religion fundamental against the creator then also you go with it.’
He is humiliated by opposite sex perhaps and he can’t bear any person getting pleased with the opposite sex.
It is the root cause why he is so against me.
He can’t bear my extra ordinary success with the opposite sex.
Particularly, if the opposite sex is the Muslimat.
Well, I did not rape them for your kind information.
I did not go around or behind them.
I am a professional free lance writer and I don’t despise sex as you despise it.
You despise sex because you can’t get it.
I love sex because I was always offered the same from the kind and loving opposite sex.
Yes, Muslimat.
Arab Muslimat even.
They offered it, I honored them.
I don’t know what they found in me.
I don’t know what was unique in me for them.
I always asked them.
They told me I have abnormal sex capability.
They told me I love sex while their males detest it. According to them it was the unique thing I have.
Well, they offered themselves to me and I honored them.
What should have I done?
Refused to them as Hazrat Yusuf (AS) refused to Zulekha and went to Jail?
I am not Hazrat Yusuf(AS).
I never claimed to be.
He(AS) was a great personality.
I can’t even imagine to compete with him.
I respect him(AS).
Nevertheless, I am a simple and normal man.
I do not have his(AS) approach to the almighty.
If I would have to go to jail, I don’t think there will be any dream to the rulers of the day to take me out of jail.
I am not that important to the Creator as Hazrat Yusuf (AS) were.
What do you want?
I should have gone to jail instead?
Well,I refuse.
Yes, I enjoyed and still enjoy the opposite sex offered to me by themselves.
So what?
It is our, I repeat, OUR, PERSONAL MATTER.
They wanted to enjoy sex with me.
I honored their kind and only human wishes.
Why is it crime against the Creator?
No. It was not.
I did not rape them.
They did not rape me.
What happened, happened with mutual consent.
We all enjoyed it very much.
If Creator had not approved of it, He could have stopped us, as easily as He can.
You feel humiliated because they are Muslimat.
Why should you?
You are not their guardian.
Even if you were, they are adults themselves.
They have all rights on their own bodies.
Certainly, you can’t claim that they did not have the rights you have.
And if you want religious confirmation, I have it here:
‘Udyachchhadhvamap raxo hanathemam
nareem sukr’te dadhat.’
‘Stand up! make the wicked run away beating him up. Give this woman to the man who does noble deeds.’
Ved: 4 Atharvved: Kand 14: Sookt 1: Mantr 59.’
I follow Ved. I am a Hindu. I never denied it.’
I admitted:
‘Now, at last, we are getting somewhere with this queer person!
He/She writes:
‘enjoying and getting pleased by the opposite sex even though its against the religion fundamental against the creator then also you go with it.’
He is humiliated by opposite sex perhaps and he can’t bear any person getting pleased with the opposite sex.
It is the root cause why he is so against me.
He can’t bear my extra ordinary success with the opposite sex.
Particularly, if the opposite sex is the Muslimat.
Well, I did not rape them for your kind information.
I did not go around or behind them.
I am a professional free lance writer and I don’t despise sex as you despise it.
You despise sex because you can’t get it.
I love sex because I was always offered the same from the kind and loving opposite sex.
Yes, Muslimat.
Arab Muslimat even.
They offered it, I honored them.
I don’t know what they found in me.
I don’t know what was unique in me for them.
I always asked them.
They told me I have abnormal sex capability.
They told me I love sex while their males detest it. According to them it was the unique thing I have.
Well, they offered themselves to me and I honored them.
What should have I done?
Refused to them as Hazrat Yusuf (AS) refused to Zulekha and went to Jail?
I am not Hazrat Yusuf(AS).
I never claimed to be.
He(AS) was a great personality.
I can’t even imagine to compete with him.
I respect him(AS).
Nevertheless, I am a simple and normal man.
I do not have his(AS) approach to the almighty.
If I would have to go to jail, I don’t think there will be any dream to the rulers of the day to take me out of jail.
I am not that important to the Creator as Hazrat Yusuf (AS) were.
What do you want?
I should have gone to jail instead?
Well,I refuse.
Yes, I enjoyed and still enjoy the opposite sex offered to me by themselves.
So what?
It is our, I repeat, OUR, PERSONAL MATTER.
They wanted to enjoy sex with me.
I honored their kind and only human wishes.
Why is it crime against the Creator?
No. It was not.
I did not rape them.
They did not rape me.
What happened, happened with mutual consent.
We all enjoyed it very much.
If Creator had not approved of it, He could have stopped us, as easily as He can.
You feel humiliated because they are Muslimat.
Why should you?
You are not their guardian.
Even if you were, they are adults themselves.
They have all rights on their own bodies.
Certainly, you can’t claim that they did not have the rights you have.
And if you want religious confirmation, I have it here:
‘Udyachchhadhvamap raxo hanathemam
nareem sukr’te dadhat.’
‘Stand up! make the wicked run away beating him up. Give this woman to the man who does noble deeds.’
Ved: 4 Atharvved: Kand 14: Sookt 1: Mantr 59.’
I follow Ved. I am a Hindu. I never denied it.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p22#c525
AAAA said:
‘by your comments we can make out what kind of a guy you are pleasure seekers.
as you just want SEX thats it, for that you want to utilise this and gain the trust and attack them from behind, i can make it out.
it useless conversing with you,
we go for Halaal thing not for HARAAM,
HARAAM IS you life style . as alhamdulila i m muslims i go for Halaal.
this is the difference between you & US.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p23#c533
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p20#c480
DAK London, UK commented:
‘Mutauly consented sex should not be anyone’s business. Of course the parties invovled sshould not hurt innocent third party’s stake when they are already invovled. however, the decision is theirs.
Sex in this way is not like killing or incitement to killing. But rape should be haram, even after military conquests.
How many of elder Pakistani soldiers took part in rapes in foramer East Pakistan? How many brought to justice? Was that halal or haram?’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p23#c534
I said:
‘I copy paste what Dak has written.
You may take it as my answer to you too:
Mutauly consented sex should not be anyone’s business. Of course the parties invovled sshould not hurt innocent third party’s stake when they are already invovled. however, the decision is theirs.
Sex in this way is not like killing or incitement to killing. But rape should be haram, even after military conquests.
How many of elder Pakistani soldiers took part in rapes in foramer East Pakistan? How many brought to justice? Was that halal or haram?’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p23#c539
I thanked Dak too:
‘Thank you my friend!
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p23#c540
I said further:
‘While the answer, DAK provided, is the complete answer to him, let’s analyze his comment.
This person is profoundly jealous of me because perhaps the opposite sex has rejected him entirely .
Yet, the same opposite sex is ravenous to have me to the extent that even no religious prohibition can stop them from it.
Let’s analyze why it is so.
AAA is unable to understand that some males have exceptionally abnormal sexual capabilities.
It is a fact and no fact can be argued.
A fact is a fact.
One has to accept it.
Even if it is rejected, the fact remains a fact nevertheless.
Similarly, AAAA cannot understand that there are some females who have abnormal sexual lust.(Contd.
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
He must go through:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_male_sexua…
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Masculinity
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Machismo
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phallus
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phallic_symbol#I…
From his so far communal and immensely illogical posts I doubt he will ever go through these links.
However, it will help the persons interested to understand my wife, me and my female friends more:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_female_sex…
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypersexuality
This post is for analytical purpose only.
He does not need to answer it.
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8IF30JQNC11F5L81/p23#c546
Challenger India responded:
Sidrah Bombay, India said:
‘Salman wrote:
‘About Namaz Hazrat Muhammad (SAW) said that “the only difference between a believer and a non-believer is Namaz”.’
So in that case, you do agree that a person who observes salat is not a kaafir, right?
Who is sidrah? Who is salman? What is the background of this statement?’
http://www.topix.com/forum/religion/hindu/TP2P6FRCNPV69P5ND/p3#c46
I replied:
Read original posts.
I’ve given continuous links everywhere.
Ask Salman for the statement.
http://www.topix.com/forum/religion/hindu/TP2P6FRCNPV69P5ND/p3#c48
Challenger was too moron to understand my post. He asked again:
Which posts? Give reference names. Mr. Salman! Who is this Salman?
http://www.topix.com/forum/religion/hindu/TP2P6FRCNPV69P5ND/p3#c49
Naturally, He was ashamed of the realization that what say is stark naked TRUTH:
Most Present day Muslms don’t do what Huzoor(SAW) did.
Satyamev jayte naanr’tam.
Ultimately, Truth prevails.
‘Fabiayyi aalaai Rabbikumaa tukazzibaani’
Which of the bounties of your Lordwill you, twain, then deny?’
–Al Qur’an Al Kareem: 55 Ar-Rahman|13-77.
————————————————————————————————————————————-
More on Islam from DSM Sayarthi:
1. Bal huv qur’anum majeedun fe LAUHIM MAHFOOZIN
2. Innahu laquranun kareemun Fee kitabin maknoonin
3. ‘Hudallilmuttaqeen’: ‘Guidance for controllers of organs’: 2 Al Baqarah: 2
4. ‘Alaa qalbik litakoon minal-munzireen’ ‘upon your heart one of who to warn’
5. Muslimahs! Come to India. I recommend Hindu lovers for all the Muslimahs.: Khadeejah Muhammad
6. Islam according to Qur’an and Maulana Maududi rahamatullh alaihi
7. A Moment of grave thinking for the entire sophisticated Muslim Community
8. ‘SET THIS WOMAN for WELL DOER’: ‘Imaam naareem Sukr’te dadhaat’
9. ‘V’ innahu fe UMMALKITAABI ladainaa la’liyyun hakeemun’: 43/4
10. Most Present day Muslms don’t do what Huzoor(SAW) did:
11. The Muslim beauties are wooing Hindu men FASTEST
12. ‘What really matters in the sight of God’: Maulana: Maududi
13. Why did Islam face a counter revolution at Karbala?
14. Why there are differences among us?
15. No differences Please!
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2. More On Hinduism
3. On Islam
4. On History
Hinduism according to Ved: DSM Satyarthi 