Communal Muslims discuss my
Muslim wife, me and my Muslim
women: Durgesh
Deepak Delhi India wrote on March 15, 2008:
‘Hey all u.I dont know whether they do or not,but I certainly know they(Muslim) dont like to.My girlfriend is a muslim and I know many other muslim girls through her.
I must say it might be alarming for muslims that they(most of muslim girls)think they are not given any outdoor freedom otherwise, they do not bother marrying hindu boys.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
NIZAMUDDIN Bangalore, India said:
‘I WENT TO TELL U THAT OUT OF 100 MUSLIM GIRLS ONLY 10GIRLS LIKE TO MARRY ANY TYPE OF CAST BOYS BUT NOT ALL OF THEM…. BUT WHO MARRY OTHER CAST BOY I BELIEVE THAT THEY ARE NOT TRUE MUSLIM GIRLS.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
Muxy Islamabad, Pakistan said:
‘this is all shit
nothind of this sort is prohabited
ur religion may allow to have sex with bitches.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
I said:
‘i disagree with you Mr. Nizamuddin! I’m a Hindu. My wife is a Saiyada. She taught even me what the real Islam is. Through her I love Islam more today than I was not married to her. she maintains her Panjvaqta Namazes. She practices Tilavate Qur’ano Ahadees even. I wonder, if she is not a true Muslim girl, what she is. Will you care to answer?’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
I resonded further:
‘Deepak is right. The Muslimat are revolting against Muslim males in a large number now everywhere.
The astonishing fact is that they don’t only want to marry Hindu males they want Hindu males for even sex out of wedlock.
They love to have Hindu boyfriends.
The trend is continued even in modern Muslim women. Even if they are not one man women, they still want Hindu males only to have sex with. They hate Muslim males immensely and even go to the extent to calling them impotent. They want to disgrace them and love their humiliation enjoying it immensely.
I have come into contact in a large number with these Muslim Women. I find it troublesome to keep them in control for not to disgrace Muslim males. They enjoy disgracing them and even express their disapproval if I try to control them. They still try to make me even join them in disgracing Muslim males to the extent that I feel myself awkward and not justified to my conscience.
Isn’t it really a matter to alarm the Muslim males and to change themselves accordingly?’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
Salman Karachi, Pakistan said:
‘Actually Hindu/Sikh girls don’t bother about marrying Muslim boys and it’s good for us my 1 cousin married a Hindu girl and other married a Sikh girl but those ladies were not true Hindu or Sikh coz they married Muslim men.
so we both have a different experiance.right!
Cheers.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
I said:
‘I have experienced sex with countless Muslimat of various age groups. I have love married a Saiyada. I am in constant touch with todays Muslimat. I think I know them more than even the Muslims know them. The Muslims never tried to understand them is their impression and they love me because they think I understand them more and love them as they are.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
Salman Karachi said:
‘You didn’t answer me!
If Muslim men are unable to satisfy their women or they don’t understand their women than how can they understand non-Muslim women? Since if this is the case than not a single Hindu girl should marry a Muslim.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
I said:
‘You have understood me totally wrong. Only because the forum is running with communal fools you have placed also me with them.
I’m not of the opinion that all the Muslims are impotent and all the Hindus are Kamsutr specialists.
I’ve written till now only what I’ve seen and realized.
I don’t hate Muslims or Pakistanis.
Hence I don’t need to answer you on the lines you propose.
What I write is only in general.
The Muslims also include Maulana Saiyad Abul Aala Maududi, Dr. Abul Kalam our former President, Sahir Ludhiyanvi the great poet etc. I respect these Muslims more than even the born Hindus. Naturally you can’t assume I think them impotents (nauzbillah!).
I wrote till now only what I experienced.
I don’t want the Muslims should continue to what they are alleged to be.
I want them to be capable enough to solve every problem they face.
I respect Islam, Qur’ano ahadees to the extent I read them as I read Ved. I respect Huzoor(s) very much.
I don’t know what I had written which made you to get me entirely wrong.
yes! I’m in contact with the Muslimat who hate the Muslim males altogether but at the same time they charge me that I behave as if I’m a Muslim more than as if I’m a Hindu.
So my dear friend! you can easily see why I don’t need to answer you on the lines you asked.
I do not mean that at all.
Alhamdulillah!’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
I said further:
‘Please go through all my 130 comments,7936 Comments NOW. You will realize my sincerity. The communals use altogether different language.
One can’t hide love and hate altogether!’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
Salman Karachi, Pakistan said:
‘Don’t get me wrong but as you have said Muslim girls attracts towards you (if they) because you act like a Muslim and not a Hindu.
If your wife is a Muslim she is no more a Muslim. This is according to the teachings of Islam I am not extremist but these are the basics which cannot be neglected.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
I responded:
‘I don’t agree with you. Sorry.
You say you are mot an extremist. Yet, you behave like one.
You say the Muslim girls are attracted to me because I act like a Muslim, but they actually charge me for it that I’m more Muslim than I’m a Hindu. They do not appreciate it. They want me to act like a Hindu. They say a Muslim cannot make love to them without proper nikah, but a Hindu can. So, I should remain Hindu. My wife is a Saiyada and is Panjvaqta Namazi. She is a PhD in Islamic Arabian Literature. In her spare times she reads Qur’ano ahadees and Tareekhe Islami. If she is not Muslim, who is Muslim? Who does not know Arabian even? Who can’t read and understand Qur’an in its original language? She did not have any sexual relations with me till we married, while the other Muslimat compel me to have sex with them. Yet they are Muslimat and my wife is not?
I am unable to understand your logic. My father in law laughed when I told him what you have written. His comment is: The average Muslims are fools. They do not know what Islam really is. Islam is not in names and exhibitions to be a Muslim. You (i.e. I) are a better Muslim than the born ones. You don’t need certificate from Muslims. Allah is enough for you. And he recited:
‘The Jews say that the Christians have nothing and the Christians say that the Jews have nothing of it, though both read the Scripture. And those who have no knowledge of the Scripture also make similar claims. Allah will surely give His judgment on the Day of Resurrection in all the matters in which they differ.’
—Al Qur’an Al Kareem: 2 Al Baqarah:113
‘The fact is that no one has any special claim to Paradise; whoever surrenders himself to Allah in obedience and follows the Right Way, shall get his reward from his Lord: there shall be neither fear nor grief for such people.’
—Al Qur’an Al Kareem: 2 Al Baqarah:112
I think my father in law is right.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
Salman Karachi, Pakistan said:
‘Sorry I don’t agree with you.
I have never said that if any Muslim girl wants sex with a non-Muslim man than she is a Muslim. Definitely if she commits such act she is out from Islam.
‘And give not (Muslim women) in marriage to idolaters until they believe [al-Baqara 221]
Therefore, it is not allowed for disbeliever to marry a Muslim woman. Allah also says,
‘They (Muslim women) are not lawful for them (the
disbelievers) nor are they (the disbeliever) lawful for them [al-Mumtahana 10]
Now what Quran says is right according to our belief.
Durgesh! I would like to talk to your Father in Law give me any email or something so that I may contact him.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
He said further:
‘I respect every religion and I fell in love with a Sindhi Hindu girl when I was in College I asked her to convert but she refused hence I could not marry her. But she did the right thing we must be on one side rather than in multiple boats.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
‘Islam is all about belief. You should appreciate the fact that Islam doesn’t allow to have sex before ‘Nikah’ don’t you think that this helps preventing ills in the society. I am sure Hinduism must have some thing like this commandment (though I don’t know much about Hinduism).
Yes! An average Muslim can’t understand Arabic but they can read the translation and I used to read the translation as I also can’t understand Arabic.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
I said:
‘I’m sorry you could not get your love. She should have accepted conversion. I think she is a looser. I don’t think she is a monotheist otherwise she would have recognized that going into depth there is no difference between Hinduism as preached in Ved and Islam as preached in Qur’an except only in some matters. These differences are there within even in a religion among its many sects.
I’m really sorry for you that you could not get your love. Did not you go to duaa? I think you could have been blessed.
My father in law does not have any email address. He has not learned even to use a computer nor he is interested.
Hinduism does not have its system belief oriented.
It is result oriented.
Average Hindu does not know what the real Hinduism is. They also follow blindly their priests as the average Muslims do. Real Islam is there in Qur’ano ahadees. Similarly real Hinduism is in Ved.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
I further said:
‘I repeat the Aayate kareema you have quoted:
‘And give not (Muslim women) in marriage to idolaters until they believe [al-Baqara 221]’
Who said I’m an idolator? You assumed it. Isn’t it? For your information my dear friend! I am not an idolator. I never worshipped any idol. I belong to a Hindu monotheist family. If you want to learn about Hindu monotheism, go to ‘DSMS’s Weblog@wordpress.com’.
https://dsms.wordpress.com/2008/01/04/ved-ved-…
https://dsms.wordpress.com/2008/02/20/ved-rgve…
https://dsms.wordpress.com/2008/09/22/ved-yaju…
The Aayate Kareema you quoted does not stop a Muslim girl to marry me.
It’s only the wrong interpretations of Islam which are being impeached everywhere not Islam.
I quote here one of my poems:
‘No differences Please!
No differences please!
No differences please! No differences please!
Not racial, not fathial, never one of these!
No gender differences even I would like ever,
If she is a woman I’ll love her, it is clever.
I will give her every right whatever I have,
If she is in trouble, I would like her to save.
If she is a Muslim I’m Hindu if so what?
Together we each other will share every thought.
Don’t try to make us fight, keep both together,
Keep us happy, you will find, nice it is ever.
Don’t make it prestige point, try to make us love,
Humanity, friends, you find overall above.
Let’s laugh to each problem,
Weeping never better,
Even we may solve them if,
We’ll work together.
Let’s try to find everything common we have,
Keep positive ourselves ever, we should behave.
Try to find differences we have lots of them,
Try what we have in common,
Plenty they are same.
Try begin with common, try begin with common
We’ll find happiness thus, we will be in heaven’
One more poem from me:
‘‘Why there are differences among us?
‘Why there are differences among us?
Everybody is making too much fuss.
If I am born in a Hindu family am I responsible for it?
If you are born in a Muslim family are you responsible for it?
If he is born in a Christian family is he responsible?
If she is born in a Jew family is she responsible?
Why can’t we intermarry if we please?
Why can’t we date each other if we please?
Are we all not descendants of Adam and Eve?
If it is not so why do you pretend to believe?
Tear up your divine books if you don’t have any faith in them.
Burn them all if you don’t need any more of them.
Stop the hypocrisy of going church every Sunday.
Stop the hypocrisy of reading Namāz five times a day.
Reciting of Mantrs in the Mandirs haven’t made you a human being if,
Shame on you that you even now claim your belief.
Ved Bible and Qur’an all teach us humanity.
Are their teachings now for you mere futility?
‘We one our nest one’ I’ve found in our divine books.
Please don’t destroy our nest allowing differences and crooks.
Follow the path of love every divine book does preach.
Prosperity and true happiness will not be then out of reach.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
Salman Karachi, Pakistan responded:
‘The bottom-line what I want to convey that Islam does not allow a marriage between a Muslim woman and non-Muslim man and if some one marries a non-Muslim than it is an individual act which should not be related with the teachings of Islam.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
I said:
‘Your bottom line does not coincide with the teachings of Al Qur’an Al Kareem. You are interpreting it communally. Get over with it my dear! Islam is not a communal religion as it has been interpreted widely by the Muslim Badshahs. They used Islam for their vested political interests. Get over with it. You are also given wisdom. Read Qur’ano ahadees yourself in their original words and interpret them yourself as they don’t clash with each other. The wrong interpretations are not representing true Islam. Huzoor(S) has not interpreted them as they are being interpreted now. Be brave man! Do justice with the great religion you are born in. Islam is for humanity not against humanity.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
Salman Karachi, Pakistan said:
‘Durgesh!
I have given you the references from Quran see the Translation below:
‘And give not (Muslim women) in marriage to idolaters until they believe’[al-Baqara 221]
‘They (Muslim women) are not lawful for them (the
disbelievers) nor are they (the disbeliever) lawful for them’[al-Mumtahana 10]
There is no interpretation required, these are clear words. There is a difference between universal truth and personal illusions and these are the basics of Islam.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
I said:
‘I have already answered your point but perhaps you have not read it carefully.
O.K. Let’s discuss the original Aayate Kareema you have resorted to:
‘Wa Laa tankihulmushrikaati’
‘Don’t marry the women who share others with Allah in their worship.’
‘Hattaa Yu’minn’
‘Until they bring Eimaan.’
‘Wa laa Tunkihul-Mushrikeen’
‘Don’t marry your women with Mushrikeen’
‘Hatta Yu’minoo’
‘Until they bring Eimaan’.
The part concerned is:
‘Wa laa Tunkihul-Mushrikeen”Hatta Yu’minoo”Don’t marry your women with Mushrikeen”Until they bring Eimaan’.
The problem is that you think any male who does not have a Muslim Arabic name is bound to be a polytheist, he cannot be a monotheist.
Qur’an puts the condition of monotheism and belief that ‘Laa ilaah illillah Muhammadurrasoolillah’. You persons go one step ahead more.
You put the condition that he must have an Arabic Muslim name also. It is not written in Qur’an. It is your interpretation.
If you still differ with it, you can give your reasons.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
Salman Karachi, Pakistan said:
‘It is not necessary that a Muslim should have a Muslim name let’s say I give you the examples of Bangladesh (East Pakistan) cricket players their names are “Rajin” and “Tushar” but they are Muslims so there is no such interpretation.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
Sidrah Bombay, India intervened:
‘Who are you to judge his wife’s faith and to decide whether or not she is Muslim? Tell me one thing frankly. How many times in a day do you offer namaz? How much of the Quran do you read daily? How often do you remember Allah SWT in your everyday life? How much of the Islamic laws and practises do you, yourself, actually follow? When it’s strictly forbidden for a Muslim to lie, do you always speak the truth? When slander and backbiting is strongly forbidden, haven’t you ever done so? Search into your own soul first and ask yourself whether you’re true to your faith, whether you’re indeed a Muslim yourself, before pointing fingers at the faith of others.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
I asked Salman:
‘Then how do you say my wife is not a Muslim?’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
Sidrah said to me:
‘If, by his reasoning, your wife is not Muslim, then by the same reasoning, he is not Muslim either. He knows that, too, yet some people just cannot give up being ardent hypocrites.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
atif Lahore, Pakistan interfered:
‘ur charecter should be great under burqa. allaha sy daro dnya say nahi. i love my sisters who wear burqa. wsslaam.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
Salman Karachi, Pakistan responded:
‘I m no one to judge any one’s faith neither I m pointing figure but you both are mixing it up if you talk about me I don’t want to express but Alhamdullilah I offer prayers 5 times a day, yes not daily but I read Quran couple of times in a week its up to you if you call me a hypocrite I wont mind.
There is logical reasoning for every thing first of all why you punish a criminal? Answer is to set an example for the others so that they should not follow the footsteps of a criminal. Secondly it’s not about names it’s about beliefs Hindus believe on Idols do Muslims believe on idols? Look at above Aayats Allah says that Muslim woman can’t marry a disbeliever. Yes I would find a concrete evidence for the penalty of such acts.
I admit that I am a very weak Muslim may Allah forgive me but again I would say that if you are lying, backbiting or doing any illegal act it’s your own act your individual act and you should not say that it is allowed in Islam. do what ever you want but then if you commit a act which really disgrace Islam than you have no right to say proudly that u r a Muslim.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
I thanked Sidrah:
‘Thanks Sidra!
Salman! I wait for your Islamic answer according to Qur’ano ahadeese Muqaddasat.
I am unable how do you people decide about anybody’s Eiman and announce fatwas so boldly.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
Then I responded to Salman Karachi Pakistan:
‘Who is disgracing Islam and how? A person is claiming she is a Muslim. And she is really a better Muslim than even you are. She is a PhD in Arabic Islamic literature. You are not.
Why she did PhD in Arabic Islamic literature, if she is not a Muslim? Why she did not do it in Hinduism or atheism?
You are not a PhD in Arabic Islamic literature yet you are a Muslim and she is not? What a logic!
You yourself accept you do not pray five times a day–she does, yet, she is not a Muslim, and you are? Great!
She should pay like Benazeer paid for being a Muslim woman! Isn’t it?
These are Muslims! Dying to throw a Muslima out of Islam as if Islam is their father’s property!
Bravo!’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
To Atif Lahore Pakistan, I responded:
‘Character must be great of Muslimat only. Not of Muslims! Isn’t it? Read what Sidra has written.
Islam is property of Muslim males only! They will tell Allah on Aakhirat who is Muslim and who is not!
Allah will not decide it, they will decide!
And they say they are following Qur’ano ahadees! Better than Muslimat!
What a joke!’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
Then I responded to Sidrah’s comment:
‘Sidra wrote:
<quoted text>
‘Who are you to judge his wife’s faith and to decide whether or not she is Muslim? Tell me one thing frankly. How many times in a day do you offer namaz? How much of the Quran do you read daily? How often do you remember Allah SWT in your everyday life? How much of the Islamic laws and practises do you, yourself, actually follow? When it’s strictly forbidden for a Muslim to lie, do you always speak the truth? When slander and backbiting is strongly forbidden, haven’t you ever done so? Search into your own soul first and ask yourself whether you’re true to your faith, whether you’re indeed a Muslim yourself, before pointing fingers at the faith of others.’
I said:
‘She is absolutely right.
Sidra! I thank you again.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
Sidrah Bombay, India asked Salman:
‘In what way have I disgraced Islam? And in what way have you honored Islam? You, yourself, admit you are a “weak Muslim,” yet you want to place yourself on the judge’s seat and play the role of judge and executioner. I suggest you try putting your own house in order first, before pointing fingers at others.
Tell me, in what way are you better than somebody like, let’s say, Durgesh Jabalpur’s wife? The way I see it, if we take into account what he has said, she’s a much better practising Muslim than you are. The only “flaw” in her, it would seem, is that she has married a Hindu man. So, you mean to say that because of that, she is not a Muslim, and just because you have not gone through an interfaith marriage, even though you’re not steadfast in your religious practises, even though you’re a weak Muslim in your own words, you’re better off than her in every possible way? It’s ridiculous to think of it.
It’s certainly wrong to call a person that is steadfast in prayer a kaafir, and I fail to understand how you can be certain that her namaz and ibaadat are not being accepted, while yours is. What makes you think you’re better off in Allah SWT’s eyes than her? But of course, you haven’t married a kaafir, and that does make you superior to others like her, doesn’t it? That too, even if you’re far behind her in regular prayer.
If you’re really so bothered about instances like this, perhaps you should start asking yourself the question as to why it’s happening, find out the cause of it, and try to eradicate that cause. I’m sure, if you searched earnestly, you’d realize why Muslim women have started opting for non-Muslim partners. Somewhere, there’s something lacking for sure, but typical of Muslim male chauvinism, rather than accept your own shortcomings, you’re obviously going to pin the blame on the girl.
All I ask for is a change in the attitudes and mindset of the Muslim males. Today, to cite just one example, a Muslim girl can rarely pass through a Muslim locality without having to undergo countless lewd gazes, at times teasing, or similar uncalled-for actions from young Muslim males. Incidentally, these men are supposed to be protectors of the girl’s honor, in accordance with Islamic texts, but more than often, these very men are at the forefront in doing and thinking otherwise. I’ve lived in Muslim localities much of my life, and I have to admit that I really feel ashamed and insecure to be walking down the streets, when I should have had a sense of total security instead in the first place. You don’t find this in other localities. Chasing girls seems to be the top priority of Muslim males nowadays. Wouldn’t it be better off if, instead, they were to change their attitudes, open up, have a decent education, put it to good use, and try to live decent, progressive lives, rather than hang around in the streets in groups doing nothing worthy?
Finally, I don’t need you to read me what I have the right to do and what I haven’t. I’m proud to be Muslim, and I always will be proud to be Muslim. It’s a feeling that comes from deep inside and, by the Grace of Allah SWT, nothing’s ever going to change that feeling.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
I responded:
‘Sidra is again absolutely right.
I thank you again, Sidra!’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
sheppy New Delhi, India interfered:
‘agr yehi hai to phir tumhare saadhu sant to khule aam aurto ko chodte hai uska kya’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
I asked:
‘Kis Saadhu ne, kis Sant ne, kab, kahan, khule aam ayraton ko choda?’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
Salman said:
‘First of all I never said that I do not offer prayers 5 times a day! Read my post again.
Secondly a religion is a set of rules. These rules are defined and we have to obey those rules. Yes Durgesh’s wife is a PhD in Islamic studies but how can she miss such a basic rule?
It’s not me who is enforcing my decision, this is Islamic law there are some crimes for which there is less penalty and for bigger crimes there are large punishments.
It is not permissible for a Muslim woman to marry a kaafir (non-Muslim), whether he is Jewish, Christian or an idol-worshipper, because the man has authority over his wife, and it is not permissible for a kaafir to have authority over a Muslim woman.Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):
“And give not (your daughters) in marriage to Al Mushrikoon till they believe (in Allaah Alone)”[al-Baqarah 2:221]
“And never will Allaah grant to the disbelievers a way (to triumph) over the believers”[al-Nisaa’ 4:141]
And the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said:“Islam should prevail and should not be prevailed over.”
If a Muslim woman marries a kaafir when she knows the ruling, then she is a zaaniyah (adulteress), and her punishment is the punishment for adultery. If she was ignorant of the ruling then she is excused, but they must be separated, and there is no need for a divorce because the marriage is null and void. On this basis, the Muslim woman whom Allaah has honored with Islam and her guardian must beware of that and must adhere to the limits set by Allaah, and they must feel proud of Islam. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):
“Those who take disbelievers for Awliyaa’(protectors or helpers or friends) instead of believers, do they seek honour, power and glory with them? Verily, then to Allaah belongs all honor, power and glory”[al-Nisaa’ 4:139]
In the end I would again say that I m no one to judge but these are the rules.Do what you want but if you are doing against the Islamic law than tell me who are you to say that look i m a Muslim and I don’t obey the rules. There are some ethical and moral values.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
Salman further said to Sidrah:
‘Sidra! You gave your decision about my being a hypocrite but you didn’t ask a single question to the person who started this thread with a title which is disgracing Muslim women.
I m really surprised!’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
He went on further:
‘Those Muslim men who are chasing women and doing nothing worthy are equally responsible and we as a Muslim should be ashamed of what they are doing but should we also become the part of mob which is going against Islam shouldn’t we set a example for them to follow?
I am afraid that this is not a justification that if Muslim men are not following Islam so that women should marry non Muslims saying that since men are not educated and financially strong hence we will go against the teachings of Islam and marry non-Muslims without converting them.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
Then he said to me:
‘Durgesh!
The murder of Benazir Bhutto is a political murder. She had been the PM of Pakistan twice means you are again mistaking by relating it with Islam.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
I responded:
‘I never said the murder of Benazeer is associated with Islam. After so long discussions one after another you do not understand me even a bit.
Go thrugh all my more than 250 comments and tell me which of them is associating any wickedness with Islam. You can’t find even a single one of them.
You have again written me a Kaafir which shows you are totally unable to understand me. I’m not Mushrik nor Kafir. I’m a Hindu monotheist. I respect Qur’an, Islam, and Huzoor(s). Thank God! you are not Allah. Otherwise you would have put me into dozakh till now.
Call me Kafir if it suits you.
I only pray may God bless you with wisdom and may God raise you above Firqaparasti.
You haven’t understood Islam beyond the firqaparasti imposed on it. You haven’t any courage even. Benazeer was murdered as Raziya Sultana was. Both were killed on the name of islam but not for Islam–for the vested political interests of the murderers. They were most helpless women of the world–Muslim women–according to Dr. BR Ambedkar(Pakistan or Partttion of India).
My wife says ‘Thank Allah! we are not in Pakistan. We are in India’.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
I further responded to Salman:
‘Salman wrote:
Those Muslim men who are chasing women and doing nothing worthy are equally responsible and we as a Muslim should be ashamed of what they are doing but should we also become the part of mob which is going against Islam shouldn’t we set a example for them to follow?
I am afraid that this is not a justification that if Muslim men are not following Islam so that women should marry non Muslims saying that since men are not educated and financially strong hence we will go against the teachings of Islam and marry non-Muslims without converting them.’
I said sarcastically:
‘But they are Muslims anyway! Because they are males not females!They are serving Islam. The males will be judged by a different criteria and the females by different. This is the Islam you have understood. Thank God! It is not the real Islam full of gross injustices against the faultless persons!’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
I further said:
‘I am afraid that this is not a justification that if Muslim men are not following Islam so that women should marry non Muslims saying that since men are not educated and financially strong hence we will go against the teachings of Islam and marry non-Muslims without converting them.’
What a logic! If the Muslim men are not following Islam they are still Muslim.
Great!
Quote some Aayate Kareema to the effect if you can find it.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
‘Those Muslim men who are chasing women and doing nothing worthy are equally responsible and we as a Muslim should be ashamed of what they are doing.’
that’s all. We should be ashamed of them. But we will still continue to call them Muslims and believing that they will get Jannat. After all, they are males not females.
Females will not be forgiven for anything they do and the males will be never punished for anything they do. This is the understanding of Islam you are conveying! Great!
but should we also become the part of mob which is going against Islam shouldn’t we set a example for them to follow?’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
‘but should we also become the part of mob which is going against Islam shouldn’t we set a example for them to follow?’
And what is the example proposed? Call the Muslim women non Muslim?’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
Sidrah responded to it:
‘They do have an example to follow – in Prophet Muhammad (SAW). If they cannot reform themselves by his example, what makes you think your setting an example is going to make any difference?
Yes, it is sort of a justification, and the Muslim male is to blame for it. Today, Muslim men occupy the lowest rungs of society – academically and financially – and the icing on the cake is their narrow way of thinking. Now, I’m not talking about the few that have succeeded in life, but the average Muslim male, in general, lacks a decent education; is financially insecure; if he is financially well off, he’s usually not educated; and you’ll find the uncultured lot in abundance. Yet, most worrying is the Muslim male’s perceptions on women, which are too narrow and restrictive, and his demeanor towards them is more or less pathetic to say the least.
Every woman desires a good life and, from my point of view, I fail to perceive what woman would be happy with a man like this. Still, I do not say that Muslim women should seek kaafir men as partners, and I certainly do not promote it, nor do I encourage it. However, that said, if a Muslim women were to do so, I wouldn’t condemn it either. Plus, she certainly wouldn’t be a kaafir to me, not unless she actually changed her faith.
Finally, let me tell you one thing. I’m married to a kaafir myself. I’ve been for the last six years. Do I regret it? Not in the least bit. I couldn’t have asked for a happier life. Yet, I practise my religion earnestly. I offer salat five times a day. I recite the Quran several times a day. I fast through the month of Ramadan. I never bow to anybody besides Allah SWT, not even my husband’s idols, and by His Grace, I never will.
There’s a lot more I can add to that list, but I do not want to send out the wrong impression that I’m trying to blow my own trumpet.
So, if somebody were to tell me, despite this, that I was a kaafir, I would definitely give that person a piece of my mind. I know I’m Muslim, as much as I’m proud to be one.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
I said:
‘Bravo Sidra! One thing out of context. My wife has thanked you for presenting her case on Internet so skillfully. And I too want to thank you for it. Please note, we both are intensely grateful to you and will remain so.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
Sidrah responded:
‘What I did, I did for myself. I wanted to send out my message, and I did. I don’t believe there’s anything for you to feel grateful about. Nevertheless, I thank you for the support you’ve shown me all along.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
I said:
‘You are a very good and lovable person. Please enlist me and my wife in your friends‘ list.’
‘What do you mean by enlisting you?’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…I clarified:
‘Don’t get me wrong! I mentioned my wife also! I respect you. It was nothing sinister! It was only an expression of gratitude. Forget it if you don’t like it, and sorry! if it really conveyed something sinister! I did not mean it. I’ll never mean anything sinister to a person like you.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…Sidrah said:
‘Relax. I never believed it was anything sinister. I just wanted to know if by “enlisting,” you meant adding you to a messenger list or something of the sort.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…I said:
‘It was and is only an offer of true friendship. You can accept or reject it.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
Sidrah said:
‘I have no issues accepting it.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
lol lingum Owings Mills, MD Double AAAA?, interfered:
‘Worship me:)’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
I smiled at the idiot:
‘Only because you worship me? Sorry! You keep on. I can’t.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
Salman Karachi, Pakistan asked:
‘When did I say that those Muslim men who are going against the teachings of Islam are pious?
Let me clear this once again, if a Muslim man marries a Christian or Jew woman than it is not necessary to convert her BUT it would be better if he converts her and for any idol worshipper woman he must convert her.
But it is not allowed for Muslim women to marry any non-Muslim to marry with out converting him.And if she decides to marry a non-Muslim man than he is committing ‘Zina’(unlawful sexual relationship).
Now these are the rulings if any one doesn’t want to obey them it’s his/her headache but these are not my rules these are agreed upon Islamic rules which needs to be followed.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
I told him:
‘Agreed Political Islamic Rules.
Islam is not Politics.
Islam is Far much greater than what you are conceiving it is.
I and my wife both do not need your foolish certificate for our Eiman.
They are persons like you who are sending the Muslim women like my wife Saiyada Fatima PhD in Arabic Islamic Literature in complete loss of any expectations from Muslim males.
They don’t want to come out of Communal Political system of Islam devised by then so called Muslim Badshahs to suit their vested political interests.
The person as great as Akbar was forced to devise a new religion Dine Ilahi due to the persons like you.
You struggle to throw away even genuine Muslims even better in practice than you, till you succeed or die.
Well, keep it on.
The sophisticated Muslimat like my wife, and Sidrah, have already found the way to get rid off the persons like you.
Only because Islam was used politically for a long long time by Muslim Badshahs to suit their then vested political interests you think only that is the real Islam.
What is conversion?
Conversion of heart or conversion of appearances? Conversion of Exhibitions?
You choose second.
We choose the first.
I think me a better Hindu and a better Muslim than even you are and if you think I am a Kafir, go ahead and prepare yourself for roze mahshar where my hands will be on your collars in front of Allah and Rasoole Arabi(S) both.
‘The Jews say that the Christians have nothing and the Christians say that the Jews have nothing of it, though both read the Scripture. And those who have no knowledge of the Scripture also make similar claims. Allah will surely give His judgment on the Day of Resurrection in all the matters in which they differ.’
–Al Qur’an Al Kareem: 2 Al Baqarah: 113
‘The fact is that no one has any special claim to Paradise; whoever surrenders himself to Allah in obedience and follows the Right Way, shall get his reward from his Lord: there shall be neither fear nor grief for such people.’
–Al Qur’an Al Kareem: 2 Al Baqarah: 112
‘wala taAAthaw fee al-ardi mufsideena’
Do not spread disorder on earth.
―Al Qur’an Al Majeed 2 Al Baqarah: 60.
‘Whenever it is said to them, “Spread not disorder on the earth”, their reply is, “We only seek to put things aright”.
― Al Qur’ān Al Kareem: 2 Al Baqarah: 11
‘Beware! They do spread disorder but they realize it not.’
― Al Qur’ān Al Kareem: 2 Al Baqarah: 12′
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
AAAA Jeddah, Saudi Arabia said:
‘you guys always quote out of the context and spread fake information dear enemy of islam.
i repeat again can you answere the below .
“They are enveloped in darkness, in other words, are steeped in ignorance and sunk in the greatest depths of misery who worship the uncreated, eternal prakrti — the material cause of the world — in place of the All-pervading God, BUT THOSE WHO WORSHIP VISIBLE THINGS BORN OF THE PRAKRTI, such as the earth, trees, bodies (human and the like) in place of God are enveloped in still greater darkness, in other words, they are extremely foolish, fall into an awful hell of pain and sorrow, and suffer terribly for a long time.” — Yajur Veda 40:9.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
He asked further:
‘can you justify the below
LORD KRSNA MARRIES 16,000 WIVES & THEN DESTROYS HIS OWN FAMILY TO DEPOPULATE THE EARTH
Lord Krsna must be seriously lacking foresight to screw so many gopis, overpopulate the earth & then destroy his own family for weighing down the earth:
“Krsna became a householder (head of a household) in Dvaraka and married many wives, and had many sons and grandsons. In the race of the Yadus, no one was poor; everyone had many children, lived a long life, and respected Brahmins. But they were so numerous that one could not count them even in a hundred years. The terrible demons who had been slain in the battle of the gods and demons were born among men, and so at the command of Visnu the gods became incarnate in the race of Yadus to repress the demons…. When Krsna had killed the demons, and thus relieved the burden of the earth, he thought,’The earth is still overburdened by the unbearably burdensome race of the Yadus. No one else can overcome them, since they are under my protection.’… Deluded by Krsna’s power of delusion, and cursed by the Brahmins, they were all destroyed, and when his entire family had been destroyed, Krsna said,’The burden has been removed.’ ” — Srimad Bhagavatam 10:90:27-44; 11:1:1-4; 11:30:1-25.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
It was answered later on separately:
Why did Lord Kr’shn marry 16,100 Sheikhzadis?:
http://www.topix.com/forum/religion/hindu/TII…
Why does Ved support Polygamy?
http://www.topix.com/forum/religion/hindu/TL6…
AAAA went on further:
‘Durgesh, i have post some question for you but no reply , why are you running away from me. if you have any points quote with authentic REF & don’t quote out of the context like you country writer ARUN SHOURIE does. This is message from a BELIEVER.I M Servant of ALLAH.
“And do not marry Al-Mushrikaat (idolatresses) till they believe (worship Allaah Alone). And indeed a slave woman who believes is better than a (free) Mushrikah (idolatress), even though she pleases you. And give not (your daughters) in marriage to ;Mushrikoon till they believe (in Allaah Alone) and verily, a believing slave is better than a (free) Mushrik (idolater), even though he pleases you. Those (Al-Mushrikoon) invite you to the Fire, but Allaah invites (you) to Paradise and forgiveness by His Leave, and makes His Ayaat (proofs, evidences, verses, lessons, signs, revelations, etc.) clear to mankind that they may remember”
[al-Baqarah 2:221]’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
AAAA said further:
‘Islam says women and men are equal not identical.
for you information we WORSHIP THE CREATOR NOT THE CREATED, when you own holy book says to you why you don’t believe.
“They are enveloped in darkness, in other words, are steeped in ignorance and sunk in the greatest depths of misery who worship the uncreated, eternal prakrti — the material cause of the world — in place of the All-pervading God, BUT THOSE WHO WORSHIP VISIBLE THINGS BORN OF THE PRAKRTI, such as the earth, trees, bodies (human and the like) in place of God are enveloped in still greater darkness, in other words, they are extremely foolish, fall into an awful hell of pain and sorrow, and suffer terribly for a long time.” — Yajur Veda 40:9.
durgesh i m having many question for you & confused muslims who are not having knowledge of islam from authentic sources.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
Then AAAA declared:
‘this is where your girls stand.
. Western society falsely claims to have uplifted women
Western talk of women’s liberalization is nothing but a disguised form of
exploitation of her body, degradation of her soul, and deprivation of her honour.
Western society claims to have ‘uplifted’ women. On the contrary it has actually
degraded them to the status of concubines, mistresses and society butterflies
who are mere tools in the hands of pleasure seekers and sex marketeers,
hidden behind the colourful screen of ‘art’ and ‘culture’.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
Salman Karachi, Pakistan said:
‘Durgesh!
You asked about conversions, you told me what is conversion; what do you think who is a Muslim? Can a Muslim worship idols? Are these rules wrong? And if you think that these rules are my interpretation provide me the Aayat or a Quranic verse where Allah said that Muslim women should marry non-Muslim men.
It’s good if you have accepted Islam but you cannot ride in 2 boats. Why don’t you condemn the title of this thread?
Individual Interpretation of a religion for satisfying your needs is always wrong.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
I replied AAAA first:
‘I have asked so many times what is your question about the Ved Mantr you quoted?
You just quote it and ask me to answer.
What is your question?
What is there you think objectionable?
Put you question and get the answer.
Since despite my repeated questions you are not putting your question on the concerned Ved Mantr, it seems you are running away from me, not me from you.
How can anyone answer your question till you don’t ask him?
You just quote the Ved Mantr and ask me to answer it.
What is there to answer?
Where is your question on the Ved Mantr?’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
AAAA said:
‘the below is asked you in a simple English language not ARABIC which is our mother tongue.
“They are enveloped in darkness, in other words, are steeped in ignorance and sunk in the greatest depths of misery who worship the uncreated, eternal prakrti — the material cause of the world — in place of the All-pervading God, BUT THOSE WHO WORSHIP VISIBLE THINGS BORN OF THE PRAKRTI, such as the earth, trees, bodies (human and the like) in place of God are enveloped in still greater darkness, in other words, they are extremely foolish, fall into an awful hell of pain and sorrow, and suffer terribly for a long time.” — Yajur Veda 40:9.
WHEN IT IS CLEARLY SAID TO YOU NOT TO WORSHIP THE CREATED , WORSHIP THE CREATOR.
then why you people worship the created, i mean all the disbelievers.
this i m quoting from your holybook.
HASBI ALLAH MIN NAIMAL VAKIL’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
I replied:
‘You are quite right.
Ask the idolaters why they do it.
I never did it, neither my family, nor any one of my ancestors.
I’m a monotheist Hindu.
Moreover, you have not quoted the intense Ved Mantr against idolatory.
Perhaps you even don’t know it.
I quote it here:
‘Na tasy’ pratima asti yasy’ naam mahadyashah’.
‘There is no idol of Him whose glory verily is great.’.
Yajurved 32|3
Ved does not support any idol worship. It is a later invent.
In entire vast book of Ved, idol is mentioned only once and even that in negation.
Ved is a total monotheistic Book.
In my own personal view Ved is the everfirst book of Islam, still in its undistorted original form . They have distorted its translations and interpretations to suit their vile purposes but the original grand monotheistic text is still there.
I see Ved and remember this Aayate Kareema from Al Qur’an Al Kareem:
‘Fabiayyi aala’i rabbikuma, tukazzibani?’
‘Which of the bounties of your Lord will you twain then deny?’ 55 Arrahman 13,16,18,21,23,25,28,30,32,34, 36,38,40,,42,45,47,49,51,53,55 ,57,59,61,63,65,67
69,71,73,75,77.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
I further replied:
‘I go on quoting an important Ved Mantr more.
It preaches the Oneness of God profoundly.
‘Indram mitram varuñamagnimaahurathodivyah s’ suparño garutmaan,
ekam sadvipraa bahudhaa vadantyagnim yamam matarishv&aanamahuh.’
‘They call Him Indr, Mitr; Varun’, Agni-Divine is He Suparñ, Garutmaan.
The noble persons with wisdom call One Existence in many ways. They call Agni, Yam, Maatarishvan.’
– Ved1R/1/164/46.
Should I repeat:
‘Fabiayyi aala’i rabbikuma, tukazzibani?’
‘Which of the bounties of your Lord will you twain then deny?’
Al Qur’an Al Kareem:55 Arrahman 13,16,18,21,23,25,28,30,32,34, 36,38,40,,42,45,47,49,51,53,55 ,57,59,61,63,65,67
69,71,73,75,77.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
Sidrah Bombay, India asked:
‘Can I have a word with you? Is there any way of sending a PM or something on this board?’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
I responded:
‘Get my email address: satyarthi.dsm@gmail.com
You are most welcome.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
Then I responded to Salman:
‘Salman! You have asked:
‘Can a Muslim worship idols?’
My answer is:
‘No. A big no! All the idol worshipers are not Muslims whoever they are.
There is no question about it.
Moreover, according to Ved, they are not even Hindus.
Interesting!
Isn’t it?
Your next question:
‘Are these rules wrong?’
My answer:
NO!
Every law provided in Ved & Qur’an is final and supreme to me.
Your next question:
‘And if you think that these rules are my interpretation–‘
I don’t think so. You have quoted Aayaate Kareemat. It decides the matter once and for all.
Any person who accepts the authority of Qur’an can’t deny it.
I accept the authority of Qur’an. I have already told you that.
The question is who is Muslim.
You deny my and my wife’s Eiman.
I differ with you absolutely, and so my wife.
The problem lies here.
You think every interpretations of Qur’ano ahadees done by Muslim Badshahs or for them are true Islam.
We refuse to degrade Islam to the extent and as so condemn every attempt profoundly.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
‘You have written:’It’s good if you have accepted Islam but you cannot ride in 2 boats.’
No! I have not accepted Islam. I am born in it.
I was never an idolater.
I never shared anyone with the God.
I believe in profound Oneness of God right from the day I became able to understand something and it was taught to me by my father, a great monotheist Hindu.
I am not riding in two boats.
Hinduism and Islam are not two boats at all as per Ved and Qur’an. It is profound stupidity of The so called Hindus and the so called Muslims that they don’t consult their own books of God and quarrel with each other foolishly.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
Salman said:
‘Durgesh!
My friend I just want to say that I m no one to judge any one’s Iman it is a matter which must be decided by Allah. But what I have under stood after talking to you that you believe on one God but you said that you are a Hindu at the same time; but there are some other believes in Islam which differs from Hinduism so how can you say that both the religions are same?
For example Hazrat Muhammad (SAW) crushed the idols after the conquest of Macca so being a Hindu can you do this?(Again I would say don’t get me wrong and I m not giving any Muslim king example I m giving the example of Prophet Muhammad (SAW)).’
Durgesh!
My friend I just want to say that I m no one to judge any one’s Iman it is a matter which must be decided by Allah. But what I have under stood after talking to you that you believe on one God but you said that you are a Hindu at the same time; but there are some other believes in Islam which differs from Hinduism so how can you say that both the religions are same?
For example Hazrat Muhammad (SAW) crushed the idols after the conquest of Macca so being a Hindu can you do this?(Again I would say don’t get me wrong and I m not giving any Muslim king example I m giving the example of Prophet Muhammad (SAW)).
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
‘I think the biggest confusion you have is saying that religions are different will led to a war between religions which is wrong. We don’t need to fight on religion but at the same time religions are different which doesn’t mean that people should fight on religion.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
I replied:
‘No! I am not confused at all.
The difference of opinion arises because we don’t mean the same thing when we use the words already very much in use.
I believe the religion is what our divine books preach, not that we believe and practice.
When I use the word Hinduism I always mean what the Ved preaches, irrespective of what the so called Hindus believe, practice, or preach.
Their wishes are not Hinduism.
It is not my self devised definition of Hinduism.
Ved claims:
‘svayambhooryathatathyatoartha – nvyadadhachchhashvateebhyah samabhyah’
‘The Self Existent has constituted the values for eternal subjects forever according to facts.’
-Ved:2Y: 40/8.
Manusmr’ti supports it:
‘Vedo’khilo dharmmoolam’
‘The entire Ved is the root of Dharm.’
Manusmr’ti 2|6
‘Dharmjigyasmananam pramanam paramam Shrutih’.
‘For the persons who want to know what the Dharm is, Ved is the absolute criteria.’
Manusmr’ti 2|13
You don’t believe it.
You believe Hinduism is what you find in the practices of the so called Hindus.
It is the fundamental difference of opinion we two have between us.
Till we have this fundamental difference there will always be this or that differences between our discussions.
We will never agree with each other.
Similarly, I believe Islam is what Qur’ano ahadeese muqaddasat tell us, not what Muslims believe, do and practice.
You differ with me here also.
You believe Islam is what interpreted by the Muslim Badshahs or for them also.
I differ with you strongly and fundamentally.
It brings all the other differences between us about Islam and Muslims.
The difference of opinion will always be there as we differ in our fundamental definitions.
Sorry! but it is the actual truth.
Sorry to differ with you so profoundly.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
I went on to reply Salman:
‘Salman wrote:
Durgesh!
My friend I just want to say that I m no one to judge any one’s Iman it is a matter which must be decided by Allah. But what I have under stood after talking to you that you believe on one God but you said that you are a Hindu at the same time; but there are some other believes in Islam which differs from Hinduism so how can you say that both the religions are same?
For example Hazrat Muhammad (SAW) crushed the idols after the conquest of Macca so being a Hindu can you do this?(Again I would say don’t get me wrong and I m not giving any Muslim king example I m giving the example of Prophet Muhammad (SAW)).’
I told:
‘Again the same objection that I have already answered.
When I say I am a Hindu, I do not mean that I am an Idol worshiper.
I hate idol worship.
According to Ved Eishan Param Brahm Paramatma, i.e. the God, has no idol at all.
You find an image of idol worshiper as soon as you hear the word Hindu.
That is the trouble between us.
We don’t mean same thing by the word Hindu.
The definition of Hindu is not my self devised definition.
It is written in Sanskr’t dictionaries.
Shabd Kalpdrum states:
‘Hindurdushtnr’h prokto’naary’neetividooshakah
Saddharmpaalako Vidvan Shrautdharmparaayanah.’
‘A Hindu is the one who never compromise with a wicked. He abolishes the wicked policies. He practices the religion of existence. He is full of wisdom. He is efficient in Dharm as preached in Ved.’
The other definitions of Hindu also follow this dictionary meaning:
‘Hinsaya dooyate chittam yasy’ tadapi hinasti dushtan yah s’ Hindurityabhidheeyate.’
‘One whose conscience does not feel at ease at violence but nevertheless he kills a wicked is called a Hindu.’
You do not accept these authentic definitions of a Hindu and I am adamant that these are the only authentic definitions of a Hindu. I am Hindu according to these authentic definitions. Whenever I claim to be Hindu I always refer to these authentic definitions, not to an idolater.
You can see yourself there is nothing to associate idolatry with Hinduism in these definitions.
The rest of the answer is coninued in next box.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
AAAA interfered:
‘then you are a communist or you are living in a confused state, Make up your mind?
And whoever contradicts and opposes the Messenger (Muhammad, Peace Be
Upon Him) after the right path has been shown clearly to him, and
follows other than the believers'(Ummah/Sahaba) ways. We shall keep
him in the path he has chosen, and burn him in Hell – what an evil
destination.(Surah An-Nisaa 4:115)’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
‘The name hindu is given by a muslim you can read you counrty history if you want.in the book “discovery of india”. and one of indian writer viveknanda has also mention that name ‘hindu plays a misnoma. the actual name should be “Vedantist”. the people who lived on the other side of the river Indus are called HINDUS. that is what is your country history, so make up your mind. don’t be hypocrites and think with a open Mind.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
He repeated:
‘how can you justify this?
LORD KRSNA MARRIES 16,000 WIVES & THEN DESTROYS HIS OWN FAMILY TO DEPOPULATE THE EARTH
Lord Krsna must be seriously lacking foresight to screw so many gopis, overpopulate the earth & then destroy his own family for weighing down the earth:
“Krsna became a householder (head of a household) in Dvaraka and married many wives, and had many sons and grandsons. In the race of the Yadus, no one was poor; everyone had many children, lived a long life, and respected Brahmins. But they were so numerous that one could not count them even in a hundred years. The terrible demons who had been slain in the battle of the gods and demons were born among men, and so at the command of Visnu the gods became incarnate in the race of Yadus to repress the demons…. When Krsna had killed the demons, and thus relieved the burden of the earth, he thought,’The earth is still overburdened by the unbearably burdensome race of the Yadus. No one else can overcome them, since they are under my protection.’… Deluded by Krsna’s power of delusion, and cursed by the Brahmins, they were all destroyed, and when his entire family had been destroyed, Krsna said,’The burden has been removed.’ ” — Srimad Bhagavatam 10:90:27-44; 11:1:1-4; 11:30:1-25.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
Why did Lord Kr’shn marry 16,100 Sheikhzadis?:
http://www.topix.com/forum/religion/hindu/TII…
Why does Ved support Polygamy?:
http://www.topix.com/forum/religion/hindu/TL6…
I said:
‘For example Hazrat Muhammad (SAW) crushed the idols after the conquest of Macca so being a Hindu can you do this?(Again I would say don’t get me wrong and I m not giving any Muslim king example I m giving the example of Prophet Muhammad (SAW)).
Hindu tradition differs here profoundly.
We respect what Huzoor(S) did.
He was the apostle of the God.
He did knew better what he(S) was doing.
We,the normal persons do not have any right to criticize the great revolutionist(S) of his time.
We should only try to understand what he did and why he would have done it.
Then we should follow him(S) according to Al Qur’an Al Majeed.
We do not have any right to contradict or criticize him(S).
He(S) was bestowed with Meraj. We are not.
He(S) knew more than us.
He(S)sacrificed his life fighting against evil.
Nevertheless, Hindu tradition differs here.
Mind you! I’m telling Hindu tradition! not Hinduism!
There are many persons who are adamant that every Hindu tradition is Hinduism.
I don’t.
Hindu tradition is to explain the person what the real truth is. Explain him/her everything in quite detail. But never compel him to do anything against her/his wishes.
We convince one that idol worship is not preached in Ved.
Ved preaches Meditation.
We explain what is wrong in idol worship and what is better in meditation.
Yet, the ultimate decision rests with her/him.
We do not compel anyone to change one’s faith.
We never insist.
He/she has her/his own reasoning.
We will discuss with one for years, but will never compel.
The decision must be hers/his.
It does not mean that we criticize Huzoor(s) for His(S) crushing of idols.
No! We don’t think we have any right to.
He(S) understood more what he(S) did.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
Salman Karachi, Pakistan said:
‘You don’t have to say sorry. Actually I like this conversation, any ways you said
“Similarly, I believe Islam is what Qur’ano ahadeese muqaddasat tell us, not what Muslims believe, do and practice”.
What Muslims do is according to Islam. There are things which they don’t practice (which is wrong) but Islam is not just a religion it is a complete code of life and as a Muslim you have to implement Islam in your life for example if you don’t offer prayers means that you are saying. that “ok I believe on Islam but I don’t want to offer prayers and I believe that offering prayers means that I m showing that I m a Muslim where as it is better to be a Muslim from Inside”.
Similarly if you don’t practice Hinduism that is also wrong if you are a Hindu.
About Namaz Hazrat Muhammad (SAW) said that “the only difference between a believer and a non-believer is Namaz”.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
I replied AAAA first:
‘You have written:
then you are a communist or you are living in a confused state, Make up your mind?’
I am unable to follow your reasoning!
Do you know what a communist is?
I am confident you don’t.
I am giving you a web address. Click it to know what a communist is first, then we will discuss on this point:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communist
‘or you are living in a confused state.’
No! I am not! I am quite clear! There is no confusion at all.
My mind is already made up.
‘And whoever contradicts and opposes the Messenger (Muhammad, Peace Be
Upon Him) after the right path has been shown clearly to him.’
I am neither contradicting nor opposing Huzoor(S).
‘The Jews say that the Christians have nothing and the Christians say that the Jews have nothing of it, though both read the Scripture. And those who have no knowledge of the Scripture also make similar claims. Allah will surely give His judgment on the Day of Resurrection in all the matters in which they differ.’
Al Qur’an Al Kareem: 2 Al Baqarah: 113
‘The fact is that no one has any special claim to Paradise; whoever surrenders himself to Allah in obedience and follows the Right Way, shall get his reward from his Lord: there shall be neither fear nor grief for such people.’
Al Qur’an Al Kareem: 2 Al Baqarah: 112
‘wala ta’asaw fl-arzi mufsideen’
Do not spread disorder on earth.
Al Qur’an Al Majeed 2 Al Baqarah: 60.
‘Whenever it is said to them, “Spread not disorder on the earth”, their reply is, “We only seek to put things aright”.
Al Qur’an Al Kareem: 2 Al Baqarah: 11
‘Beware! They do spread disorder but they realize it not.’
Al Qur’an Al Kareem: 2 Al Baqarah: 12
I believe, Allah knows better, what is Islam; than you.
Sorry to differ with you altogether in the matter.’
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/pakistan/T8I…
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More on Hinduism from DSM Satyarthi:
1. ‘Bhoorbhuvah svah!’ ‘The Existence! The Consciousness! The Bliss!’
2.‘Devasy’ pashy’ kaavyam, n’ mamaar, n’ jeeryati.’
3. Hinduism shines
4.Ved is the eternal law book having infinite knowledge in it for human beings
5. ‘According to facts’: ‘Yaathaatathyatah’
6. ‘SET THIS WOMAN for WELL DOER’: ‘Imaam naareem Sukr’te dadhaat’
7. The Evernew Hinduism: Yaathaatathyatah: Ved 2|40|8
8. ‘How to cross death’: ‘Tamev viditvaati mr’tyumeti’: Ved2Yajurved|31|18
9. According to Hinduism: We must be polite, not coward
10.Ye yathaa maam prapadyante taanstathaiv bhajaamyaham: Lord Kr’shn
11. ‘Maachchhitthaa asmaallokaat’ ‘Be not severed from this world’: Ved
12. The mental slavery of the English-educated Indians
14. ‘S’ janaas! indrah’: Who is indr?’: Ved: 1 R’gved: 2|12|2: No scientific error
15. ‘Vidva ch’ vedehi samechch dhammam’ ‘Intellectuals acquire knowledge from Ved’
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More on Islam from DSM Sayarthi:
1. Bal huv qur’anum majeedun fe LAUHIM MAHFOOZIN
2. Innahu laquranun kareemun Fee kitabin maknoonin
3. ‘Hudallilmuttaqeen’: ‘Guidance for controllers of organs’: 2 Al Baqarah: 2
4. ‘Alaa qalbik litakoon minal-munzireen’ ‘upon your heart one of who to warn’
5. Muslimahs! Come to India. I recommend Hindu lovers for all the Muslimahs.: Khadeejah Muhammad
6. Islam according to Qur’an and Maulana Maududi rahamatullh alaihi
Commentary on Ved from DSM Satyarthi:
1. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 1| Mantr 1
2. R’gved: Mandal 1| Sookt 1| Mantr 2
3. R’gved: Mandal 2| Sookt 1| Mantr 1
4. R’gved: Mandal 3| Sookt 1| Mantr 1
5. R’gved: Mandal 4| Sookt 1| Mantr 1
6. R’gved: Mandal 5| Sookt 1| Mantr 1
7. R’gved: Mandal 6| Sookt 1| Mantr 1
8. R’gved: Mandal 7| Sookt 1| Mantr 1
9. R’gved: Mandal 8| Sookt 1| Mantr 1
10. R’gved: Mandal 9| Sookt 1| Mantr 1
11. R’gved: Mandal 10| Sookt 1| Mantr 1
12. Yajurved: Adhyaay’ 1| Mantr 1
13. Saamved: Mantr 1
Hinduism according to Ved: DSM Satyarthi 